Wednesday, March 04, 2009

LOST: Season 5 Episode 8 - LaFleur

Hello Losties! I'm sure most of us are still trying to wrap our heads around Ben's reasoning for talking down Locke from the noose only to take him down within minutes! But, this week we had to catch up with our LEFT BEHINDERS to find out what happened to them after Johnny Boy Beamed off the Island. LaFleur was a lot slower paced than our past couple of episodes, but still chock full of little goodies we can talk about. And of course, the moment we wanted to come much sooner in the episode was saved for the episode ending 2-week cliffhanger! Ahhhh LOST! Gotta love it! I enjoyed the episode, as I do every episode. But, compared to the last couple of episodes, we're bound for a bit of let down! So we'll just give it a one exclamation point WOW! The episode served the purpose that it had to serve, told the story that needed to be told, and now we can move on to the exciting stuff! We're at the midpoing of the season folks, can you believe it? Only 26 hours left of LOST from now until May 2010. Yikes, well let's not start crying now, let's get into the episode!


So this episode starts off immediately after Locke falls down the well. When we last left our Island crew Daniel was hovering over Charlotte who passed away and Sawyer, Jin, Juliet and Miles were surrounding a rope in the ground that a few seconds before had John Locke on the other end of it. Crazy Time travel! And exactly "when" did they end up? Well there's a bit of an interesting twist there!


The Final Flash

  • We find out that when Locke fell into the Donkey Wheel cave, Sawyer and crew flashed back to a long long long long time ago! Yes folks, Miles spotted a fully constructed gigantic statue that very much looked like something that could have deteriorated over the years only to leave ONE FOOT, which happens to have 4 toes on it!
  • FINALLY, we got to see more with the statue. Naturally, we only got to see the back of the statue so no telling what the front is. Wow, so how far DID they travel back? And doesn't it look kinda Egyptian to you? I kinda think so. Let's recap all of our Egyptian paraphernalia hanging around the Island. We have the Hieroglyphics that are showing up on all ancient structures (the temple, the cave that Ben summoned Smokey from). Then we have the DHARMA Swan Station clock that showed the symbols when the clock counted down to zero. We also get a new relic in this episode that is DHARMA related as well. Let's not also forget that Hurley was drawing a picture of a Sphinx in last week's episode. Oh, and there is an Island exit in Tunisia, which is a hop-skip and a jump away from Egypt. What gives people?! Are we making some connections here? Oh, and does it seem like the statue has a nice full head of long hair? Remember way back when in season 3 when we saw a brief shot of JACOB in the rocking chair? He seemed to be sporting that haircut as well, didn't he? (okay, that part is a stretch!) But seriously, we should be tying this Egyptian stuff together by now right? An Island which some crazy energy source, ancient Egyptian artifacts, an ancient wheel deep in the Island that teleports you to Tunisia. A Smoke monster, healing powers. Yikes, I'm still LOST, but I feel like we got a crazy clue here. It would seem that the Egyptians may have been the first residents of the Island. THEORIZE away! And now that we know the statue was COMPLETED at one time, are we now going to have to wait until season 6 to see the front?
  • Anyway, while my rant above went on for 3 hours, we only saw like 3 seconds of the statue before we got a whole new kind of flash after Locke turned the wheel. The earth shook the sky was flashing a little differently, but then we got to hear the sound we've come to know and love and BOOM....they were in a new time period sans headaches and nosebleeds. And thus, the flashing ends.
  • The well is there again, but there is no hole going deep into the earth. Hmmm, that's weird. Considering the time we know they end up in how did Charlotte know about the well to tell them it was a way to the wheel? Was it recently filled with dirt by the DHARMA Initiative? And come to think of it, now that we know that the donkey wheel exists the spinner to Tunisia, we CAN pretty much confirm that this MUST be how the Polar Bear ended up there right? I know some found this far fetched. But how else would it have happened? Can't we somehow tie this to Charlotte knowing to look in Tunisia and to her knowing about the well? I dunno, maybe I'm grasping at straws here!
  • Anyway, they assume Locke has succeeded in leaving the Island and now they will wait. How long you ask? As long as it takes...

3 Years Later (1977)

Well, looks like some of our theories when we saw Jin in the DHARMA suit turned out to be correct. We figured that if 3 years passed off of the Island, that maybe the same would happen for the people that stayed ON the Island. At this point the episode begins to flash back and forth between the 3 year period that Sawyer, Jin, Miles, Dan and Juliet waited on the Island for their friends to return. Let's break it up between the 2 time periods as best we can!

  • We open up with some DHARMA Security guards slacking on the job. Well, really just Jerry (Jason Street's Crippled friend on Friday Night Lights) and his girl Rosie are dancing to some classic jams on the reel to reel! Then Jerry's security buddy (couldn't make out his name but he was the comedian in season 2 of Mad Men) ruins the fun by saying they need to focus on their job.
  • There is a mention of Polar Bears in cages here. We already knew DHARMA was experimenting with Polar Bears, so nothing new. I just want to know how one ended up in Tunisia!
  • We see Horace Goodspeed on one of the security cameras all drunk on DHARMA Booze and blowing up trees with Dynamite (from the Black Rock maybe? We know Sawyer brings it up to him 3 years prior) If you don't remember Horace, we saw him in season 3's "The Man Behind the Curtain." On the mainland, he helped deliver Ben on the side of the road and then recruited Ben's dad Roger to work for the DHARMA initiative 12 years later. So this is still before Ben comes to the Island.
  • Anyway, the security guys summon the head of security LaFleur. And it turns out to be a clean shaven James "Sawyer" Ford. What a great name: Jim LaFleur You know the writers loved giving Sawyer that alias to go by.
  • Sawyer and Miles (Sawyer calls him Enos, not sure if it's a nickname or what he's going by) head out to pick up Horace. Horace seems to be the leader of the DHARMA initiative. His drunkenness is apparently a rare occurrence, so something was up.
  • Sawyer brings Horace to Amy (his wife) it's Michelle Dessler from 24!! Lots of recycled cast members from other TV shows in this episode!
  • Amy tells Sawyer that they got in a fight over something. Before she can reveal what, she's going into labor!
  • We learn from the doctor that all pregnant women are taken off the Island to have their children. Amy was supposed to be on the sub on Tuesday to go to the mainland. But the baby is early. It seems like they were leading us down the path for us to think that even DHARMA folk had trouble having children on the Island. But in later times, no one would have gotten to the stage of pregnancy that Amy did.
  • Anyway, a C-Section must be performed and no one there can do it. Sawyer goes and recruits Juliet who is undercover as a DHARMA Maintenance woman. She was fixing one of the vans. Juliet seems to have made an agreement with Sawyer to never work with pregnant women on the Island again due to her track record. Sawyer makes a comment that maybe whatever happens later on the Island that kills pregnant women, hasn't happened yet. This would seem to be the case.
  • Later outside of the infirmary, Jin comes to see Sawyer. Looks like Jin is on assignment looking for their friends. He searches one grid of the Island per day. His English has gotten considerably better. Now, after 3 years, that would be understandable! So, it turns out that when Jin found Jack, Hurley and Kate he was in fact actually looking for them. Crazy stuff!
  • Juliet comes out and delivers the good news to everyone. "It's a Boy!!!" And now, everyone wonders...WHO is Horace and Amy's child? Ahh, I'm not even going to start theorizing right now!
  • I think it is important to note that we did not see Dan in the 1977 storyline. We'll learn in a little bit that Dan kinda went nuts after Charlotte dies. And we saw when the Orchid Video was being filmed that he was working for DHARMA and seemed very interested in that crazy Donkey Wheel. Hmmmmm
  • Anyway, Mr. LaFleur, French for The Flower, picks a flower from a garden and heads to Juliet's house who is making a nice dinner. There's some hugging, some kissing and .....woaaaa "I LOVE YOU's" going around. Looks like Sawyer found a new gal to play house with! Not that this is a shocker, they've been building this relationship all season long, well really starting in the season 4 finale. JATERS and SKATERS might be jumping ship soon to support this new LOVEFEST!
  • Sawyer, reading a new book is watching over Horace. He wakes up and begins to explain how the fight happened. Horace found a Ankh Neclace that belonged to Paul (Amy's old husband. We'll get to that in a second too!). Horace felt that 3 years was not enough time to get over someone. Sawyer went into his speech talking about how he used to feel for Kate. But then he said he can barely remember her face anymore. 3 years is absoultely enough time to get over someone.

Let's pause this storyline and find out how they got there!


3 Years Ago (1974)


When in doubt, go to the Beach!

  • Sawyer, Miles, Juliet and Jin start heading back from the well and find Dan mumbling to himself and saying "I'm not going to go after her this time." He obviously is referring to the creepy comments Charlotte made to him right before she died. Dan is supposedly going to tell little girl Charlotte to leave the Island and never come back unless you want to die! Interesting that he was saying "this time." Kinda reminded me of when Desmond consciousness traveled back to before he was on the Island and relived key moments of his life again and tried to change things. (the first time we meet Mrs. Hawking) Anyway, he still dumps Penny and ends up back on the Island and starts ranting about wanting to go back and try it again. Am I suggesting that this version of Dan has traveled back and tried to prevent this before? No, not really. He is probably just saying it because he knows that Charlotte remembers him doing it which means he will do it. But I did find it interesting!
  • Dan told everyone that Charlotte was gone. When she died her body "moved on" and they stayed. Interesting way to put it. Wouldn't you think that "THEY MOVED" and she stayed?
  • Dan, explains how they are stuck in the time that they are there for good. Oh, and he's gone a little crazy too!
  • Sawyer takes charge with Dan "checked out" mentally. He suggests to go to the beach and wait for Locke and crew. This starts a nice running banter of jokes between Miles and Sawyer. Miles says all they ever have are 2 plans "go to the orchid, or go to the beach." Miles made a good point about the flaming arrows, but how did he know what time they were in when he said the Camp is gone? I guess because they saw the well? I don't think the well was there at all in 2005 beyond. Eh, minor semantics again. It was still great to hear Sawyer tell him to "ZIP IT!" Plus Sawyer then says "IF our stuff is there, Great, if not we build new stuff." So that covers it!
  • Juliet publicly agrees with Sawyer to help things to get moving, but then she tells him in private that it's a stupid idea. (flirtingly, albeit!) She tells him to come up with a better plan before they get there. Thankfully, there was GUNFIRE to save the day!

There's Always OTHERS to deal with

  • As anyone would, our heroes fled TO the sound of gunfire. We see 2 people that are confirmed as OTHERS, a dead guy in a DHARMA Jumpsuit, and a woman with a bag put over her head. (It's Amy that we meet 3 years from now)
  • Miles tries to confirm with Dan that they don't get involved. Apparently, living with a new theory about time travel after his Charlotte conversation, he tells Miles that it doesn't matter what they do. Whatever happened happened. So I guess he's suggesting that if Sawyer and Juliet kill 2 OTHERS, that is what always happened in the timeline. Doesn't make sense with people suddenly getting memories in the future but it's exactly what happened here! Boom, Juliet takes one down before he gets Sawyer and BAM Sawyer gets the other one. Nice little head nod-exchange from Sawyer to Juliet. The flirtation continues!
  • Dan gets a new nickname from Sawyer - Plato. And I know this comes later but he calls Miles - Banzai and well that was just a fantastic time!
  • It's interesting to note here that Juliet doesn't recognize the OTHERS. She says it is before her time. It's 27 years prior to when Juliet came to the Island. One could argue that these people COULD HAVE still been on the Island as our part of the Nomadic Others tribe. But the ironic thing is, she probably never met them because she helped kill them before she was even there. Ahhhhh Time Travel!
  • We find out that the dead DHARMA guy is Amy's first husband, Paul. (Yep, the same Paul that Horace gets all worked up about 3 years later)
  • Sawyer begins a massive lie to coverup their time-traveling future-dwelling past. He tells Amy that their ship wrecked here on the way to Tahiti.
  • He's also alarmed because the Others had a walkie and may have radioed in for reinforcements. They need to get moving.
  • Amy discusses how they need to bury the bodies. DHARMA has some kind of TRUCE with the OTHERS. We will get into the Truce a little more in a bit, but one has to wonder if breaking this TRUCE potentially led to the purge?
  • Amy also says they need to bring Paul with them. Jin volunteers to carry him. And they bury the other 2.

Back to the Barracks

  • Anyway, they begin their venture to the Barracks. Sawyer still has his take-charge attitude. Explains how he used to lie for a living so everyone just follow his lead.
  • Then Dan almost runs into Sonic Fence around the barracks. Juliet sorta blows their cover by screaming at Dan to stop! Amy looks at them now distrustingly. Juliet requests for Amy to turn it off as it looks like some sort of sonic fence. Right, because we run into those every day!
  • Long story short, she appears to change settings and walks through (but we hear some kind of noise when she does). Everyone else follows and passes out. Must've been set to a low enough setting that earplugs would do the trick for Amy!
  • Sawyer wakes up later and Horace is there to great him. He thanks Sawyer for helping Amy in the jungle. And explains that the fence incident is defense protocol against the Hostiles with whom they don't get along.
  • Horace tells Sawyer that all of his people said to talk to him because he was the "boat captain." Anyone else picture Sawyer as the Skipper in a Gilligan's Island remake for just a brief second? Anyway, he introduces himself as Jim LaFleur. Explains they got caught in a storm and shipwrecked and must've hit the reef. They all washed up on shore. He explains how they were on an expedition looking for a Slave Ship based out of England known as the Black Rock. Horace claims he never heard of the Black Rock, which for all we know could be the truth at that point. But 3 years later he most likely got the dynamite from there!
  • Sawyer explained that they were in the jungle because some of their crew went missing and they were looking for them (Are they really going to be able to explain that they finally found their crew 3 years later when they pick up Jack, Hurley and Kate? That should be interesting! But we're not there yet!).
  • Horace explains that only DHARMA members can stay on the Island and that Mr. LaFleur is NOT DHARMA material. He says that they're all going to be on the next submarine off of the Island. Funny how now that they're in the wrong time, getting off of the Island doesn't sound like such a good idea!

Meanwhile...Outside

  • Miles, Dan, Juliet and Jin wait for Sawyer to salvage the situation. Miles mentions how Sawyer is probably blabbing about time travel at this point.
  • Juliet explains how she used to live in the Barracks and how the Others took them over and wiped out mostly everyone that lived there (not Ben!)
  • Jin asked Dan if they are no longer going to flash. Dan says no and that the record is spinning again, but they're not on the song they want to be on. Ahhh how poetic. So do we think Dan is going to try and FIX the record? And that's why he is mining at the Orchid?
  • Oh right, we see Charlotte as a little girl! Dan, looks like he's going to forget all about NOT wanting to warn Charlotte this time. We'll see!
  • Sawyer catches everyone up on the situation that they believed the story but still getting booted from the Island. Oh and that LaFleur is Creole. Maybe Sawyer spent some time in New Orleans during his Conning days? Something tells me we probably won't be getting a backstory on that one!
Encounter with Richard

  • Just as they think they're luck has run out, it's The OTHERS to the rescue again! The DHARMA alarm is sounding. Someone has entered the premesis.
  • Our Heroes are put into a house under guard with someone that I swore looked like Locke's Helen for a second. But her name was Heather and upon further review, decided it was not her. That just would have been silly!
  • We then see Richard with his infamous torch enter the scene. He plants his torch in the ground and waits for someone to come talk to him. Sawyer and Juliet exchange glances "UH OH..." Dum dum dummmmmm!
  • Horace goes out to meet Richard. We find out that the Sonic Fence doesn't keep The OTHERS out of the barracks. Interesting. Do they have DHARMA earplugs too or is there something ELSE about our infamous Others? We already know Richard is an ageless wonder! Anyway, we also know he was referring to Smokey when he suggested what the fence DOES keep out.
  • Richard said that 2 of his men are missing and that the TRUCE has been broken.
  • Horace comes in to check about the bodies with Sawyer. Horace tells Mad Men guy to call the Arrow station and tell them they are at Condition Level 1 and to turn the fence on Max. We learned in the season premiere that the Arrow Station's (aka the station where our Tail Section was living hand found the glass Eye and hollowed out bible) purpose was " to develop defensive strategies and gather intelligence against the island's hostile environments" We now see that playing out here. Hmmm, if Chang was creating the Orientation Video for The Arrow in the premiere and we saw Dan there in the premiere does that suggest Dan goes even further back in time? That just can't be right. Maybe they were operating without an orientation video for awhile.
  • Anyway, Sawyer sees this as an opportunity to stay relevant. He volunteers to talk to Richard and explain the situation. Gotta love how he referenced Richard's "eyeliner" too!
  • This leads to an awesome scene between Sawyer and Richard. Sawyer explains that he killed the two others in self defense. He saw a woman in distress and saved her. Explained that he's not with DHARMA. And then explains to Richard exactly how he knows him. He asked if they buried "Jughead" 20 years before. He mentioned Locke visiting him and claiming to be their leader. He mentioned he's on the Island waiting for John Locke now. (again, this makes me think of the OTHERS telling John "we've been waiting a long time for you" - of course I still don't understand why Cindy the Oceanic 815 flight attendant said that!)
  • Richard then believes that Sawyer is not with DHARMA but that 2 of his people are still dead and they will want Justice. Now why does Richard refer to them as HIS people when he's never 1st in command? Surely, Widmore is in charge at this point!
  • Anyway, that's not important right now. What is...is that Richard wants Paul's body in exchange for his 2 dead people. Huh????? This screams of Locke coming back to life again. Are they going to offer him up to the SMOKE GODS or something? This is just bizarre. But I'm sure there is a deeper reasoning for it that we just don't know right now.
  • Horace tells Amy he is willing to accept if she doesn't want to give up Paul and that they will suffer the consequences. Amy decides to keep everyone safe by giving up Paul. She takes the Egyptian Ankh Necklace off of his neck.
  • By the way, the Ankh is another Egyptian Symbol that represents Eternal Life.
  • Interesting that he was wearing that and that The Others want his body. That's all I'm saying! Oh, that and that there is more Egyptian artifacts on the ISLAND both inside DHARMA and out. What is going on here???
  • Anyway, this wins Sawyer and crew a 2 week stay on the Island to look for their friends. But we can assume they worked that into 3 years with Sawyer's classic conning ways!
  • Ahhh and then the big scene between Sawyer and Juliet happens. Juliet has been trying to get off of the Island for a long time. Locke said that he was leaving to save them, and they appear to be saved. And even with it being 30 years earlier, she still wants to take that sub and leave the Island. She said that her life as she knew it not existing off of the Island yet is not a reason to go. Sawyer then asks if HE is a reason not to go. He goes an a great rant about how she can't leave him there with a Mad Scientist and a Mr. "I speak to Dead people" and Jin who is a great guy but not the best conversationalist. He needs her to have his back. He begs her to give him 2 weeks. And well we see what that turns into over 3 years. And thus, the birth of the new couple to root for blossoms. (And yeah, I know we already talked about it above!)


Back to the Future (3 years later)
But Present time for our 815/316/Freighter/Juliet Generationers
Yet still the Past! (1977)


Longest Blog header in Lost Addicts history! Sidenote: you would hope at least the DHARMA crew were able to leave the Island during the summer of 1977 to watch Star Wars at least a couple dozen times! Anyway, back in DHARMA-Land 1977, Sawyer and Juliet are catching some Z's and the phone rings. Jin's on the phone. Sawyer instructs Jin not to bring them in and to meet him at the North Valley. Juliet asks what is going on. Sawyer says that it's Jin and he has to go. Sawyer drives a DHARMA JEEP (new vehicle!) to meet up with Jin in his DHARMA VAN. Sawyer gets out of the car, Hurley steps out of the van with the guitar. Jack steps out in his suit. Jack and Sawyer exchange smiles. And then Sawyer sees Kate....and it would appear all feelings that he has forgotten about came rushing back within a second.

BOOM LOST!!!!
Like I said, tough to top our Oceanic 5 returning to the Island and Locke seeing Ben after his murder in the past couple of weeks. But that was still a good time! Is it enough to hold you over for 2 weeks? Yep, there is no episode next week. We knew there had to be at least a 1 week break to drag this show into the proper MAY SWEEPS Finale Week. There is still plenty to talk about over the next 2 weeks so here's a few discussion points!
  • What role will Jack, Hurley and Kate play in the DHARMA past? Will Sawyer work them into their lie? He IS head of security afterall!
  • What about all of these Egyptian Artifacts? Anyone want to venture a guess on the ultimate question to end them all? WHAT IS THE ISLAND?!
  • Will the show end with our crew stuck in the PAST or is Dan going to try and change that? I am going to guess that they won't if we have Locke and the Ajira crew in the future. And especially if SUN is separated by time from Jin.
  • How is the next interaction between Ben and Locke going to go?
  • Who is Jacob???
  • How did Christian Shephard change out of his Suit into Business Casual?
  • Why doesn't Richard age?
  • What is the Smoke Monster?
  • What happened to Desmond and Penny?
  • Charles Widmore: Good Guy or Bad Guy - Discuss
  • Ben Linus: Good Guy or Bad Guy - Discuss
  • How are Nikki and Paulo doing in the ground in 2007?
  • Did Jughead implode when the Hatch imploded?
  • How did Kelvin get to the Island? Was he there during the purge and allowed to keep pushing the button?
  • Will we ever meet Radzinsky?
  • Who are the Adam and Eve Skeletons?
  • And finally, where on earth are ROSE AND BERNARD?????!!!!!!!

Next episode looks like a doozy, but to avoid spoilers, I'll avoid discussing for now. In the comments? All bets are off! Discuss away folks. Hope you enjoyed my ramblings, NAMASTE and see you in 2 weeks!

This blog will also be posted on Gather.com. Feel free to check it out and send some votes my way! You may also stumble upon additional discussions there!

Special thanks as always to Sledgeweb for providing awesome screen shots on their site.

144 comments:

The Taylorman said...

Mike5

Just a quick point, and ill have more to come later. Your question about Kelvin and the Purge, i think it has been answered.

He was shown in the Iraq war Version 1 with sayid. Granted that was only 1990-1994ish timeline, but i just feel like the purge happened earlier than that. I would put money on Ben convincing the dude to come to the island to push the button under the pretense of Dharma, because he never mentions anybody else on the island. Ben was probably affraid of it for a time, and did not want to sacrafice his people to the task.

Thats all

Mike V. said...

Jeff, what's up with the Mike "5" ??? That's the second time you did that! I do prefer it to the other name you've been calling me though! lol

As for the purge, we know it happened 12 years prior to 2005...so that was 1993. So I guess that does fit. But then the big question is why wasn't he PURGED? Is it because no one else wanted to keep pushing that button? It kinda makes sense. He was supposed to get a replacement, and Desmond washed ashore. There was never any more DHARMA people to replace them because they were killed off. The producers have said recently that they never thought Kelvin's story needed to be revisited but they've heard a lot of feedback on the topic of how he ended up on the Island, so they may address it!

Anyway, I listed all of those questions to keep us busy for 2 weeks. Looks like it's already a successful experiment! lol

Mark said...

few of my current thoughts.

Richard definitely looks Egyptian.

And I believe that our Oceanic 5 will somehow be involved in the "incident" at the swan station.

Glass Dwarf said...

Maybe Rose and Bernard are the Adam and Eve skeletons???? They could have died when the island was in its flashing state and were left behind in the past just like Charlotte was.

Jenn said...

Another question - does anyone think that our Losties might be killed during the purge?

Also, I don't recall the name La Fleur from past episodes, but I would be curious to see if anyone recognizes his name from one of the jumpsuits on a body in the mass grave?

Jane said...

I think of myself as an avid LOST viewer but I have no clue who these Adam and Eve characters are that you guys like to talk about. And Radzinsky? Can you please remind me, or at least give me a clue of what episode they are from.
Thanks!

Shanna said...

Ahhh, all these things I don't ever think of having a deeper meaning. I just thought he wanted to Paul's body to show his people that Dharma lost someone too, so they were even. But I guess that doesn't make sense considering the Others were down 2 men and Dharma only lost Paul. Good times.

And I'm on board with Juliet and Sawyer...back off Kate! :-)

Phil From Philly said...

I'm loving the egyptian references and think you may really be on to something there. The statue we saw looks like it has long hair -- could it be an egyptian headpiece? Maybe the person that the statue is of actually is bald (aka Locke) but is wearing an egyptian headpiece.

Mike V. said...

that's funny...sometimes I don't even think of the straight forward meanings! lol I didn't even think about Richard showing them that they were even. But that "eternal life" symbol thrown in there just seems to complicate the issue!

Okay...Radzinsky was Kelvin's hold Hatch partner. He eventually went crazy and shot himself. His blood stain was on the ceiling of the Swan Hatch.

Adam and Eve Skeletons were in Season 1 of LOST and consistently referenced by Executive producers Damon Lineloff and Carlton Cuse as being placed there so that when they eventually explain it people will know they knew what they were doing from the beginning of the show. When Jack, Locke and crew first go to the caves together, they found the skeletons. Locke called them their very own Adam and Eve. They also had a pouch with black and white stones on them which become a running theme on the show (backgammon pieces, etc...) Anyway, it also is the point where Jack realized that they could LIVE in the caves, because Adam and Eve were too.

Interesting theory on Rose and Bernard dying the past. But considering no one else died from 815 and the time travel sickness as based on duration on the Island..i don't know. I would hate for that to be the way Rose and Bernard go too! But they surely need to explain where they've been!

I love the theory that maybe the Oceanic survivors,freighter folk, Juliet may have been involved with the incident!

As for LaFleur being in the DHARMA grave....yikes...I doubt that we'll ever be able to read all of those name tags. And it would be interesting to see if they're around when the purge happens. But considering it is still 16 years away, I'm guessing they might get out of there before then. We'll see though!

Don said...

Anubis
Other Names: Anpu, Inpu, Ienpw, Imeut (Lord-of-the-Place-of-Embalming).

Patron of: mummification, and the dead on their path through the underworld.

Appearance: A man with the head of a jackal-like animal. Unlike a real jackal, Anubis' head is black, representing his position as a god of the dead. He is rarely shown fully-human, but he is depicted so in the Temple of Abydos of Rameses II. There is a beautiful statue of him as a full jackal in the tomb of Tutankhamun.
Description: Anubis is an incredibly ancient god, and was the original god of the dead before Osiris "took over" the position. After that point, Anubis was changed to be one of the many sons of Osiris and the psychopomp (conductor of souls) of the underworld. His totem of the jackal is probably due to the fact that jackals would hunt at the edges of the desert, near the necropolis and cemeteries throughout Egypt.
Prayers to Anubis are found carved on the most ancient tombs in Egypt, and his duties apparently are many. He watches over the mummification process to ensure that all is done properly. He conducts the souls through the underworld, testing their knowledge of the gods and their faith. He places their heart on the Scales of Justice during the Judging of the Heart, and he feeds the souls of wicked people to Ammit.

Don said...

Another wild theory here about these Egyptian references. I don't know but I'm really beginning to think our little Island is our LOST city of Atlantis. The similarities are profound.

Islands of advanced technology

Atlantis society was divided into two long-lived political factions--a "good" faction called the "Sons of the Law of One," and an "evil" faction called the "Sons of Belial”

The final destruction of Atlantis was the overcharging of the crystal which caused a massive explosion. Or maybe not (turning the safe key, moving the island).

And of course, the legend of Atlantis’ "hall of records" located somewhere beneath the Sphinx........Hurley's little drawing.

Edward Cayce readings spoke of the existence of Atlantis, a legendary continent with an advanced technology whose refugees peopled ancient Egypt.

Does anyone see the statue leaning on maybe a cane?

MJ said...

I loved this episode, was great fun. yeah - they better start explaining how for 3 years living with Dharma they still haven't found Bernard and Rose !

Loved the 'eye liner guy' line, and the statue. Cool that the writers/producers put that stuff in there to say - we hear the fans. LOL

And did anyone else catch the little inside joke of Dan saying 'Whatever happens, happens' ?? See spoiler below




***Spoiler
That's the name of the ep coming soon that will explain what happened to Aaron
**** End spoiler



So - who can Amy's baby be ? They'd have to be around 27 years old ! Ethan ? Goodwin ? they are the only males I can think of in their late 20's - except Boone. LOL

And as for little Charlotte - that is not making sense to me. She seemed about, what, 10 when we saw her last night in 1974 ? That would put her in her early to mid-forties in 2005. No way that the Charlotte we knew was in her forties.

The Taylorman said...

Mike5,

Lord of the LOST symbolism... and you cant even get a roman numeral joke? I have lost all faith in you as a blogger. I know... its a lame joke.

I would have to agree with Dumpster Don on this Aunbis thing. They showed you the back of the statue for a reason, with its mysterious shaped head. Not sure if its Anubis or not, but defienetly an egyptian styled god. Lots of them were depicted with elaborate headgear. I know of a bunch of gods like that.

Shanna said...

I thought Charlotte looked 3 or 4! Lol

MJ said...

Almost forgot - seemed to me that Sawyer seemed shocked that he wasn't shot, then he looked at Juliette. It was like he checked himself for bullets or something. I'm gonna have to check that again.

MJ said...

Shanna - she seemed so big for just 3 or 4 but you may be right. I don't have kids so my assumptions could be way off.

Anonymous said...

Sayer had a gun pointed at him, heard a shot, but he wasn't hit - so he did sort of check himself before realizing that Juliet fired the shot. Charlotte was definitely about 3 last night when we saw her.

Unrelated question - in the repeat of last week's episode last night with the captions - they cut out the part when ceasar throws the flashlight to Ilana. Was that just for time purposes or what?

horseman said...

Has LOST explained these bits of time travel theory:
1. If Juliet did leave on the sub in 1974, would she run into herself on the mainland since she was alive in 1974 (albeit younger)?
2. When the O6 fell into the island in 1977 - do they also exist off the island at the same time?
3. If they don't, did they simply vanish in the "new 1977" when they appeared on the island?

Glass Dwarf said...

I'm liking the Anubis theory. Looking closly at the picture of the statue, you can see that it is holding what appears to be a loop in its right hand.

After searching Anubis on google images, I found that in many pictures, Anubis is holding the Ankh (by the loop at the top). It makes sense that Anubis holds a Ankh becuase the Ankh is the symbol of eternal life and Anubis is a god of the underworld and afterlife. Here's a picture of Anubis with the Ankh:
http://mythsoftheworld.net/egypt/images/anubis1big.jpg


After seeing these pictures, I think there is a reasonable good chance that the statue on the island is holding an Ankh, which would mean that it is probably a statue of Anubis.

If this is true, then the Ankh and Anubis may tie in to Richard's apparent "eternal life".

Yo said...

I have to give a shout out to my friend Joy, who recommended me to this blog and is an avid reader. She just got married too in Hawaii and gave us a good tour of some of the Lost locations.

I have to say, I enjoy reading everyone's theories and great job to Mike V on your recaps and theories. I never realized how much of the hidden meanings i have missed before reading this blog.

Quick question - are Sun and Sayid stuck in the past too? They would have to be right, since the other 3 are...

Also I was thinking that Bernard and Rose were the Adam and Eve skeletons too... I know it might be blantly too obvious but maybe the black and white stones are symbols of our interracial couple.

Brendan said...

i keep wonderin the same thing horseman just asked, it def makes no sense

Eamonn said...

yup the mystery of were Rose and Bernard are is bugging me too and there are also some other survivors of 815 left as well isn't there? Am I correct in saying we haven't seen them since the flaming arrows at the beach? My first thought when Sawyer said to Jin about looking for them in the next grid is that he was looking for these people (Rose, Bernard etc.) and not Locke et al. Any thoughts?

Anonymous said...

I am thinking that Horus and Amy's baby is Thomas (Aaron's daddy, the artist, who's painting is also in Widmores office).

Charlotte was most definately not 10 as a child, 3-4 for sure.

Could the purge be to course correct in a way, keep the 2 bunnies apart? I mean, when 815 crashes, then the losties would be there as older folks AND 815'ers, and the Dharma folks that were not losties would recognize them, would get weird and confusing....BUT purge them all and then it just starts over.

What year was it when Roger and Ben came to the island? Are they there in 77 with LeFluer as security chief?

What happened to Olivia, who we met as Horace's wife in The Man Behind the Curtain? Did somehow or other rescuing Amy change things and that is why Horace marries Amy instead of Olivia? Daniel says what happens happened, so I think not, but when do we get the skinny on what happened to Olivia?

Sorry, so many more questions!!
Jennifer

Anonymous said...

Oh, and my 10 year old son thinks that Radzinsky is going to end up being one of the losties, and had to blow his brains out before Desmond gets there and recognizes him. The only ones he thinks it could be (that would know how to fake a lockdown and know the map)is Desmond or Ben, and Kelvin would recognize Desmond, so maybe Radzinsky is Ben. Whatcha think?

Jennifer

Jane said...

I think what's going on with Locke is so cool. As far as we know, Locke is a normal guy, but he creates his own position as a leader by talking to Richard in the past and with Sawyer talking to Richard about him as well. Now Richard, and the rest of the Others, think he is this amazing chosen one bc they don't know the LOSTies are time traveling. So what's going to happen if they finally figure out he's not special? Or is he just going to continue creating his own destiny, which kind of goes against everything he's always saying about destiny, doesn't it?

Sorry if this makes no sense, but I'm sure we're all used to it by now, haha. Anyways, just thought I'd add my 2 cents!

MJ said...

Thanks to all who corrected me on young Charlotte's age ! ;-)

I can't think how the are going to attempt to bring Jack, Hurley and Kate into Dharmaville. So I wonder - we have long speculated that there were really two groups of others. Could Jack, Kate and Hurley be the beginnings of the second group ??? Hmmmmm.

Mike V. said...

Yikes...I missed too much! First of all, thanks anyone who gave compliments on the blog!

2nd - Anubis...really does kinda look like him doesnt it? How many toes does a dog have anyway? lol Very interesting stuff!

3rd - Running into themselves on and off of the Island. I'm going with the back to the future approach on this one. If you already existed in a location and time...you still exist then. So we haven't seen anyone running into themselves, but if Sawyer is alive as a boy off of the island and he left the island...he could technically run into himself. Kinda like Marty had to avoid himself in BTTF2 (worst of the 3 by the way! Although looking back...3 wasn't so good either!) Would be interesting to see this played out on the show though!

4th - i think the producers mentioned that "most of the socks" (or cast extras - i.e. other 30 something 815ers) were killed off in the flaming arrow attack. But Rose and Bernard should be okay. We'll see!

5th - yeah the Atlantis theory has been thrown around since season 1. But wasn't that GREEK stuff, not Egyptian? Ironic though, since Sawyer called Dan Plato! Plato was all about that Atlantis business!

6th - you know...i thought Horace was married to someone else in The Man Behind the Curtain! That IS really bizarre!

7th - i don't know if we know the exact year ben and roger arrived....i had originally thought he might not be there yet. but I guess he might. He arrived when he was 12 years old I think. The purge happened in 92/93...so yeah..it could be very possible he was there! Ahhh how great would it be to see Sawyer meet Roger Workman! The guy who he called Skeletor!

8th - I agree that Locke has seemed to create his own destiny by going to Richard in the 50's....but still, a baby born very prematurely, survives....survives falling 8 stories.....and then regains his legs on the Island? Oh and here's the kicker...he was killed, but came back to life! Not Special??? hmmmmmm Maybe he's less special than we think....but he does seem to be pretty unique!

I think I missed a lot...but that should do for now! Keep up the great discussion everyone!

noel said...

If the last flash that occurred took the O6ers off the plane and landed them in 1977, how is it that same last flash put Sawyer, et.al., back in 1974?
And enough about Rose and Bernard, where's Vincent???

Ian said...

Wow, so many good discussions here. I think I got more to say from reading the comments than from watching the episode!

One, I like how Don looked up the stuff about Anubis. I think you're onto something there. Jennifer misspelled Horace as "Horus," and I immediately thought "Isn't Horus the name of an Egyptian god?" Sure enough, Horus is the patron god of the rulers. Could there be any symbolism to Horace's name, or is it just a coincidence?

Mark mentioned that Richard looks Egyptian. Might that be an explanation for the eyeliner? It seems that Egyptians are often portrayed wearing eyeliner. I did a little digging and I came across this. It gives facts about ancient Egypt, and here's one item:

Did the Men Wear Makeup?

Both men and women in ancient Egypt wore a sort of eyeliner. The paint was made of minerals mixed with water, ground on palettes, and kept in tubes. It was worn for adornment and perhaps also to reduce the sun's glare.

Hmmmmm....interesting.

About Charlotte, when she first came to the island, Ben rattled off her entire bio, and he said she was born in 1979. That doesn't fit with her being a little kid in 1974. Of course, Ben also said she was born in England, so perhaps there's a lot of false stuff on her record, and Ben only knew what the "file" said. Of course, there's also the whole issue with time being relative on the island.

Mike V. said...

Noel, I don't think that's the same flash at all. I think Sawyer and crew had one last earthquaking flash and ended up in 1974.....i think when the Ajira crew was a separate flash.

Good question on vincent! I'm going to guess he's with Rose and Bernard wherever they are. And we do know that Vincent makes it to the end of the show! I also guess there really is nothing saying that Rose and Bernard can't be Adam and Eve in the cave when all is said and done. But I don't think the flashes killed them. That would just be an awful way end their storyline!

One note on Richard Alpert's eyeliner, which yes...perhaps Mr. Alpert is from the original Egyptian crew or is one of the Aliens that constructed the pyramids lol But we must note that NESTOR CARBONELL (the actor) does wear eyeliner for all of his roles. Watch The Dark Knight to confirm this! But that is not to say they didn't work his eyelining magic into the show. Afterall, they successfull worked Matthew Fox's tattoos into the show (in the worst episode ever!!!!)

As for Charlotte's birthdate being incorrect. Well Ben also said she was born in England! So there could be misinformation somewhere. We also know that Ben lies! The other alternative? well....the writers just might actually have messed up! lol But in doing so, they can justify it by Ben lying!

I agree though Ian...great comments by everyone!

Anonymous said...

Hey Mike,

Great recap as usual! Can't believe we have to wait 2 weeks for another episode!!

First I have been saying all along that the Island has to do with Atlantean/Lemurie/Mu somehow and I think the Egyptian clues this week supports that... The Ankh and the statue - and Richard Alpert's "eternal life" I also wanted to put out there that when the they flashed after Locke fixed the wheel - maybe they had to travel to the beginning and then to 1974 b/c it was the island's way of course correcting itself. It had to go to the "first song" and then to 1974.

I think we are in 1974 - not b/c of "the Purge" which does take place in 1992 but that in 1974 or 1977 there is an "incident" and that Sawyer, Jack, Juliet, Said etc have something to do with it. I think the incident occurs b/c Faraday is trying to fix the donkey wheel so they can get back to 2008 and that is why he infiltrates himself into that area of DHARMA. I also think that Faraday is the voice when Pierre Chang does the video talking about the incident and that DHARMA needs to be revitalized b/c of the "war" that is coming... most probably against Ben (but right now I can't say Ben is bad b/c his manipulation with everything tells me he knows more than anyone)

Someone asked about Olivia and Horace. Yes Olivia and Horace were there for the birth of Ben but it is not said that they were married even tho they have the same last name - perhaps they could be brother and sister. I think we also have to take into fact that Amy does look a bit more "asian" and that could determine the baby's identity. I know people are saying Ethan but I think he is more impt than that - He is someone we already know....

And remember before Faraday was recruited by Widmore, he was in Massachusetts under a caretaker and he cried while watching the remains of Flight 815 - this along with his many memory problems and journal - could suggest he's done this time travel more than once... If Charlotte remembered him telling her not to come, he's obviously done this before.... b/c the memory occurred BEFORE Faraday could have done it... Maybe all this, Flight 815, Locke... has happened before...

Jacob says to Locke "Help me" - Maybe Jacob IS Locke and he is trapped on this constant time loop but THIS TIME may be different - with the war coming - maybe THIS TIME the right side will win and Jacob will finally be set free.

Also, somewhere I read that they showed Locke with the leg cast as only having four toes.... But I dont remember seeing it - does anyone else???

And Richard is Egyptian - it is said that during the time of Atlantis - some of the members left before they were all destroyed and fled to Egypt (where they built the Sphinx and put the secret documents in the paw) - maybe he is a descendant of that time and is protecting the Hall of Records... against the "bad" people... Some have claimed that the Garden of Eden lies on the imaginary island Lemurie.... This is our Adam & Eve... I dont think it is Bernard and Rose tho it is certainly a good guess.

Just one more thing, I know this has been long, if Jacob = the island = Locke.... and this time loop has occurred before.... then maybe Locke is controlling where the time shift occurs - sending them to pivotal events to try to change the future... to try to have the right side win....

Oh and one more... heehee sorry.... I think there has to be another convo btw Jack and Locke b/c the things Jack says to Kate at the airport are things Locke did not say to Jack at the meeting in the hospital... I hope they get this corrected.

Anyways, great recap again Mike... who do you think is the baby??
Mona

Anonymous said...

Picture of the Egyptian God Anubis. Looks like the island statue.

http://www.linsdomain.com/gods&goddesses/pictures/relief-anubis.jpg

BDA said...

Mike,

I know you haven't spent that much time in the South, yet. So I can forgive you for missing the reference when Sawyer picked up Miles. He did call him Enos. As in Boss Hogg's Deputy Sheriff of Hazzard County on a little show we all know and love as The Dukes of Hazzard.

horseman said...

To me the statue looks like it is holding two identical "things", one in each hand. At first I thought they were crutches and the statue was leaning forward. But upon closer inspection, they sure look like ankhs. Which makes sense with all the other Egyptian clues. Also, from Wikipedia: Egyptian gods are often portrayed carrying it by its loop, or bearing one in each hand, arms crossed over their chest.

There is more, all confirming the information already provided by other Lost Addicts Bloggers; that the Statue could have been a welcoming symbol (or a protector) to the place of eternal life.

This definition is haunting in the context of recent events on LOST: The ankh appears frequently in Egyptian tomb paintings and other art; it often appears at the fingertips of a god or goddess in images that represent the deities of the afterlife conferring the gift of life on the dead person's mummy.

Jane said...

I'm watching last night's episode again and I have to say I do love Richard's character, he is so hot-even with the eyeliner, or especially with the eyeliner! I low his eerieness and that scene with Sawyer-amazing! I love to see them interact for the first time!

Anonymous said...

Mike V. Said:
But we must note that NESTOR CARBONELL (the actor) does wear eyeliner for all of his roles.

Actually, this is not true. Check out this interview bit:

Carbonell spoke with SCI FI Wire to promote the DVD release of the slasher film Killer Movie. The following Q&A features edited excerpts from that interview.

SCI FI WIRE:At the TV Critics Association press tour, some reporters asked if you wore eyeliner, which Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse denied. What do you think of this?

Carbonell: My brother sent me this link about the TCA, where you guys were at. Someone had asked about whether I was wearing eyeliner. I think Carlton came to my defense, and he said, "He's 100-percent sans makeup" or something like that. I could see why some people would think I have eyeliner on because [my eyelashes] are dark. Especially the bottom row, they're pretty dark. I've been dealing with it since I was a little kid, and so to me it's very funny when it comes up, especially at TCA. My brother told me to look online and sort of Google something about that, and my name came up as a couple things. One of them was Maybelline Man. I've been dubbed by some people as Guyliner. It's very amusing.


Gotta love that, Guyliner! Sounds like one of Sawyers nicknames!! Anyway, the like where I found that interview is
https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=20542067&postID=4931186921672372565

Jennifer

Anonymous said...

oops, the link, not the like.

Jennifer

ViCtor said...

Hello to all! I've just discovered this blog and think all the comments are great. Keep it up!
About Charlotte...
Perhaps Ben is telling the truth about Charlotte's age. After all, it has never been stated that she was BORN on the island. Charlotte said she had been there as a little girl and in last night's episode we saw her there as a child. But, was she born on the island? It's never been directly mentioned.
I believe she was taken there as a child, perhaps even an infant and lived there several years.
This may explain the discrepancies in time if to get to the island she too time-traveled.

ViCtor said...

Regarding the statue, I think the comments are right on. The statue is definitely Egyptian, most likely Anubis. And the ankh later on in the episode, definitely related. How important is Paul's character though, not sure. Maybe we'll find out, maybe not.
I am not 100% sure however that the statue is one in the same as the four-toed statue remnant. Look at the terrain behind the remnant. From that angle which was seen from offshore (sea level), it looks like the mountains are directly behind it. And when our "left-behinders" see it from behind, it looks like there about 1 mile inland, and not near any mountains. It isn't until they hike for a while through some forest and come up to a clearing where they rescue Amy that we see mountains in the background. Just a thought...

Anonymous said...

Jackals have 4 toes, same as dogs. The evidence seems to be piling up that there is an Egyptian connection.

Mike V. said...

Ahhh i stand corrected on Nestor Carbonell....so then he just looks that way in every role because that's just how his eyes are! lol So I guess my point remains the same...it's not like they've intentionally put eyeliner on him to make him look Egyptian!

BDA, good call on ENOS! I used to watch Dukes of Hazzard all of the time, but I totally forgot about that!

Mona, thanks for the props! I have no idea who the baby is. But how about this one? Remember we found out that Horace built Jacob's Cabin? What if HE is Jacob? He's got the crazy long hair for it. And it would be ironic that we would meet Jacob/Horace in the very episode that we hear/see Jacob for the first time. Eh, it's a stretch as well...but that was his cabin!!! There has to be some tie to Jacob there. I don't think his 27 year old son would be Jacob though. But you would think it would be someone that we've met or heard about at this point. But no one I can think of really fits the bill. hmmm

Victor, welcome to the blog! I actually believe Charlotte told Dan in the season 4 finale that she was still looking for the place where she was born. So it seemed to be implied that she was born on the island. But who knows???

Gennifer Williams said...

My goodness...what a great episode. And another fine blog Mr. V!

For some reason I always thought Horace was married to Olivia. I guess that's because they were together when they found Emily in labor. Maybe that was his first wife, and she died before The Purge. Now, was Horace building the cabin for Olivia or Amy? I think his hair was shorter back then, so maybe it was built while Olivia was still around. In the beginning I was thinking that Horace's fight with Amy was about the baby being Paul's. Yeah he had been dead for years, but at this point nothing on the island would surprise me. I really want to learn the grounds of this truce. The Others apparently love to make deals of "we'll leave you alone if you do the same." Unless of course you're a pregnant woman, and then they have no qualms about throwing a potato sack over your head and dragging you off into the woods. I love the juxtaposition of the lies told by the island group and the O6. The O6 lied so they could be secluded from the public, while the islanders lied to be included as part of Dharma. You can tell part of Sawyer is happy to establish another long con.



There was something so appropriate about Juliet being a mechanic. It just fit her somehow. She said every time she tried to help a woman give birth on the island, they died. It sounded like she was talking about her Other days, and not her three years with Dharma.



Poor Daniel, seeing young Charlotte and grappling with whether or not he can change the past (or really the idea of if he was always meant to change it anyway). Charlotte said she was born on the island, but Amy's doctor said all the births occurred on the mainland. If that is true, is Charlotte Dharma or an Other? I thought the freighter group would all turn out to have been sired by Others. Danie's mom should be Ellie, who was an Other. Miles will probably turn out to be the son of Amy (not likely) or Dr. Chau, which would make him Dharma. Naomi might've been an island baby too. Does the island care if your parents were Dharma or Other? Constant or no constant, Daniel was able to handle those flashes fairly well...



We see that Richard's people can't be stopped by the sonic fence. But it did neutralize Patchy for a bit, so I'm not sure why it doesn't harm the Hostiles. Seems weird that the fence can stop big bad Smokie but not the Others. Also, where is Richard getting his clothes from? When Ben met him as a child, he was all shaggy and unkempt. Now we see him stroll into the compound with his button down shirt and pressed slacks. Sawyer's eyeliner crack made me chuckle.



That ankh that Amy took from Paul, I thought I remember Miles wearing a similar necklace at one point. Speaking of Miles, do his "powers" still work in the past? Whoever Amy's son turns out to be, I just hope it isn't Sawyer. James only adopted that identity because of watching his mom get killed by his father. To all of a sudden find out that James was taken off the island at some point to be "raised by another" would change a large part of his backstory. Not to mention how wrong it would be to have his foster parents killed and his bio parents die in The Purge. Doesn't the man have enough baggage already? I could see the baby being Desmond. Henry Ian Cusick was born in '67, so the age would be about right. Plus with his Peruvian and Scottish background, I think he would pass as the child of Amy and Horace.



I'm liking Sawyer and Juliet as a couple. Hope we get to hear what her nickname is. Surprisingly they're way less dysfunctional than Jack and Kate. But I have to say, seeing Sawyer lock eyes with Kate made me waver a little. I love how this season everything has been turned on its ear. The group dynamics have really changed. You have people that were once allies now working at cross purposes.

Thomas Burleson said...

The statue reminds me of the Colossus of Rhodes---one of the 7 wonders of the Ancient World.

Check it out: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colossus_of_Rhodes

Anonymous said...

Hey Mike,

Ooooohhhh good one! Horace being Jacob?!?! Or what if Horace's son IS Jacob - and he was building the cabin for his son - like a playhouse - or what if his son was deformed or something (maybe why children are not born on the island anymore) and he was to be put away.... could explain why he hates light/technology and when Ben tells him to stop shaking the cabin - that he's had his fun - like telling a child???? lol am just throwing ideas out there....

But (in the Bible) if Jacob is great-great-grandfather of Aaron.... Maybe that is why Christian is allowed to speak on his behalf b/c Christian is Jacob's grandson...

Aghhhhh LOST makes my head spin sometimes!!! Can't think about it anymore lol....

Whatever the case may be - this baby is probably the first baby to be born on the island besides Aaron.... which now comes to mind, remember Claire couldn't feel the baby when they first crashed but then she ate a piece of fish then she did.... Perhaps Aaron was dead but then the island infused "eternal life" into him... Maybe he's like Walt - magical/eerie/weird powers right and he says something to Kate that scares the beejesus out of her and that is why she says "Never ask me about Aaron"

In any case, Ben claims he is the first child to be born on the island - when in actuality this child is.... Perhaps that is why Ben speaks to him so casually but yet so fearful... b/c he knows this child is the actual Jacob... His reverence for Horace is probably b/c knowing he fathered Jacob, the infinite.

Anyways good discussion going on Mike, I've also noticed you stopped blogging about previews of next week episodes?? You should keep doing it!

Mona

Thomas Burleson said...

...or even better maybe it's the statue of Ramesses II (another Egyptian reference for you Mike)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statue_of_Ramesses_II_(Mit_Rahina)

Tony Reid said...

Hey folks.....really good discussion going on here.

I keep wishing that we had answers to all these questions but then I realize that when we do, Lost will be over forever. I never want it to end.

I guess I am part of the camp who enjoyed seeing Sawyer and Juliet together. He tried so hard to get Kate to stay and make the same little happy household but she refused. All that poor guy wants is a happy existence with someone he can love and to be loved back. Lots of fun inside references for us junkies. Thanks for paying attention to us. I really wish Sawyer had not been as struck by Kate as he was. I would have preferred he ran to the group to embrace Hurley. Their friendship over the seasons has really been fun. I'm not a Kate hater like a lot of people but I really wish he could let all that go.

I'm still amazed by the training of the Other group. Yes, it was Juliet who shot and I noticed she made the quick decision to shoot first and ask questions later. Also, someone pondered Miles ability to work his magic into the past. Maybe he is unable to do so because he has not been born at that time (1974). If he was able to do the ghostbusting you would have thought he would communicate with all three bodies and find out what exactly happened.

Lastly, for now, is there some sort of burial ritual necessary to rest in peace on the island? Amy seemed franticed to bury the two Others and then there was some sort of reason why the Other's wanted Paul's body. I realized Richard wanted to them for the truce purposes and they needed proof of a Dharma kill but is there some sort of reason why you do NOT want someone from the opposing group to bury your dead? Do you only rest in peace if your own group buries you? It makes me all the more curious about Colleen's funeral when her body was sent out to sea. And she was an Other!

Anonymous said...

Mr. V.....nice little recap even though you only rated the latest episode as a one WOWer.

Just wondering if you have the website www.timelooptheory.com

Seems pretty plausible and I think it gets updated every week but I could be wrong about that.

Continued success with your blog and may all future LOST episodes be WOW WOW WOW WOW WOW!

Gladys Pipkins

Anonymous said...

Just a couple other things:
Miles does have his mojo, remember when he walked over the graves of the 3 soldiers, who had died from radiation poisoning? That was in '54, so before he was born would not have any effect.

and

Horace can't be Jacob, or the new baby, because in '54 Locke tells Richard that "Jacob sent him" and that is what made Richard listen to him. So Jacob was around before '54 at least.

I have to get a google identity, this annonomous stuff is old since I love this blog Mike!

Jennifer

Mike V. said...

Wanted to share the new "Getting LOST" video on TV Guide. Enjoy!

Getting Lost

btw...good call on Jacob being referenecd in '54! Then again, we've seen Horace as a Ghost. And we have seen Christian as a GHOST supposedly during ANCIENT TIMES appearing to Locke in the Donkey Wheel cave. You just never know with that crazy Island. But I think I like the SHEPHARD lineage being linked to Jacob better right now.

Thanks for all of the blog compliments again everyone! I'll try to comment more later.

Mike V. said...

eh correction on Horace...that was a vision in a dream..not necessarily a GHOST! lol

Trent Wembley said...

Nice video link Mike. Thanks.

Now check this one out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0czFemssA94

It seriously made me laugh. Spectacularly made. Loved what they did with Daniel. Hilarous stuff.

Max said...

Love the comments everyone. I think that we are onto something with the Horrace/Jacob connection. I was out scouring the web for egyptian art images and came across an amazing website. It is quite possibly the most comprehensive lost theory site I have ever found. Thought that you all would enjoy a that I would share. Here is the link.

http://www.quasiadam.com/theoryenglish.html

horseman said...

It's probably nothing but, as we know from Macbeth, the baby was delivered via C-section so in that sense wasn't "born". So technically Ben wasn't laying (maybe) if he said that Aaron was the first baby born on the island. I know I'm grasping here, but with this show who knows!

horseman said...

I keep forgetting to ask...in the Season Opener, the drill team found the donkey wheel buried in the rock. How do you suppose it got there? If they found it circa 1974 to 1977, then obviously it was buried before that. Has that been discussed?

ViCtor said...

I think the reason for burying the dead may be as simple as not wanting the "hostiles" to find the bodies so that the truce wouldn't be broken, having hard evidence that 2 of them had been killed.
Or perhaps thats the way the island wants the dead to be dealt with.

Question: Do you guys think Horace was telling the truth when he said he had never seen/heard of the Black Rock?
Has it not shown up on the island yet?
or... did he just say that to throw off Sawyer, believing Sawyer's story that they were looking for the ship, so that they would lose interest and be sent back to the mainland the next day via submarine?

MJ said...

I'm loving Sawyer and Juliette together - but hating the name I'm seeing for them (Sawliette). LOL

Horace is clearly caucasion, Amy clearly light skinned and part-asian. So Miles should not make sense for their child as he is darker than either of them IMHO.

All I can think of is Ethan or Goodwin - but not liking those either. Feel like it will be someone more important then them.

Liking the theory the whatever the 'incident' is, our O6 are a large part of it !

AreUPokey said...

I'm going to weigh in on the Egyptian god thing here. I think as has already been mention we can say with some certainty that the statue is an Egyptian god. I would be inclined to think to the statue is Horus.

First of all, the god Horus was depicted as a falcon. He was God of the sky. We see the hieroglyph that represents Horus in the 108 countdown timer in the hatch. It was the 4th place from the left.

Second, the legend of Horus was that another god Set killed Horus' father Osiris. Horus and Set then were engaged in an epic "god war" that involved some pretty wacky stuff. This whole idea of gods battling it out because someone killed the other persons father would fit in quite well in the Lost universe.

And also of note is the sudden prominence of these Ankhs. As one person commented above these Ankhs represent life or eternal life. The statue holding these Ankhs could be in fact indicating "the protector of eternal life." If this is the case then I think it points very strongly to a certain island theory.

I have for some time now subscribed to the idea that the Island is the Garden of Eden and although much has happened that could lead us in different directions, nothing has happened that would disqualify the island from being the Garden.

The Garden of Eden was a place where humanity could have eternal life by eating from the tree of life. After the expulsion of Adam and Eve the Garden was given a "protector" to ensure that the tree of life could no longer be eaten from. Now all this Egyptian symbolism obviously points to island's ancient existence and the Garden of Eden was supposed to be located somewhere in the general vicinity of the Middle East, which of course is very close to Egypt.

The Garden is one place that was rumored to exist but cannot be found. The other is Atlantis. The best way to hide something is to have it jumping through time, eh? Perhaps the show will try to say that Atlantis and Eden are one and the same. The whole Sphinx with the Atlantean documents in the foot is a very interesting coincidence.

Kathleen said...

No one has brought up the burning question: Where's Vincent???

With Rose and Bernard?

I guess we couldn't have a time-travelling dog, because some of us would get sad if his nose started bleeding.

Kathleen

Anonymous said...

Love the Blog!!!

Is it just me, or does Richard Alpert walk like an Egyptian :p

Miles has to be Candle`s son, and he would find Candle later on and try to change History....

I'm gonna miss you lost... its will be a sad two weeks :)

Mike the Plumber said...

Mike,
Great blog...it has become a part of my Saturday morning ritual with a strong cup of Joe.
So many scenarios to consider and reading all the comments only gets me more confused (but in a good way).

Ken said...

Haven't seen it mentioned in this comment string, so:

Richard Alpert = RA = Sun God

Ken said...

Oh, and Mike, GREAT job! Love reading your recaps and everyone's comments and theories.

Anonymous said...

But he sure has commented lately has he? LOL

Anonymous said...

I meant HASN'T commented lately. LOL on me

HurleyAteMe said...

let me ask Mike 5 and the "others" on the site to voice an opinion on this thought about Horace. When Locke had his vision of Horace building the cabin, Horace nose was bleeding just like the left behinders. Do you think it is possbible that there may have been an incident in the 70's that caused time skipping similar to when Ben turned the wheel? Also is it possible that we get a look at Horace building the cabin this season if in fact he did? It looks like the same time period from JL's vision. Horace nose bleed in that scene has got me puzzled

Max said...

Hurley ate me, that is a great idea. the memory on you! If that vision was an indication of a previous incident when time was sent a skipping then that would be a great way for our losties to return to the present.

Anonymous said...

For Charlotte's mom to think she could convince Charlotte "that she made the island up" they must have left while she was pretty young.

So, I wonder if her leaving relatively soon after that, has to do with Daniel not being apart of the 1977 parts of the episode?

Ben saying that she was born in 1979, not 1971 ish, hmmmm. Why 1979? I doubt she left the island that year considering she'd be 8 or 9, too old for her mother to lie to her about the island.

Have we never seen that necklace on anyone before?

Amy and Horace's baby now 27 and a boy...

"I think we shouldn't forget the unsung Others. The Jasons and the Lukes, and Aldo"- producer

Aldo being the guy Kate threatened to shoot in the knee, guarding Karl.

I hate to pull that out of thin air, but honestly, assuming it's someone we already know, who looks 27 and would make any sense at all?

Rose

HurleyAteMe said...

Max
you may be on to something, I didnt even think about the lostee's time skipping back to the future if in deed there is a time skipping event during the 70's with DI. If this is happens, it would probably answer why the donkey wheel was froze when Ben turned it. It was probably frozen to prevent further time skipping and then the purge occured. how is that for an idea?? lol

Glass Dwarf said...

I think the reason Horace's nose was bleeding was because of the purge. If you remember, the poison gas used by Ben and the Others made the victims bleed from the nose. We know Horace was building the cabin around the time of the purge because Locke found the blueprint and a map for the cabin off Horace's dead body in the mass grave for Dharma. That means Horace was either still working on the cabin or had just finished it when the purge happened.

Mike V. said...

Hey guys...thanks again for all of the blog compliments. Glad everyone is enjoying the ongoing discussion.

Couple things:

I just don't see Aldo becoming a primetime character on LOST. Rob McElhenney, the actor, is one of the stars and creators of Always Sunny in Philadelphia. He was simply doing a cameo on one of his favorite shows. But...what do I know? lol I guess the baby could end up being one of the OTHERS though!

As for Horace with the nosebleeds...very interesting relating it to a time shift...here's the thing though...Horace died in the purge in 92/93....and if I'm not mistaken...they were all GASSED (at least we were led to believe they were gassed).....i was figuring the nosebleed was from that...but i'd have to watch "The Man Behind the Curtain" again to see if they showed a bloody nose on Horace when he died. As for the vision of Horace that Locke had? He was definitely older looking than they tried to make him in this past week's episode.

Pokey - Garden of Eden theory is pretty intriguing. Also the stuff about Horus vs. Set...i think that stuff was also in one of the links someone shared above. The whole concept of a battle vs. Good and Evil seems to be right. We know a war is coming...we just don't know who is involved in it...and who is Good vs. Bad! lol But, yeah I like how it all kinda ties into the whole black vs white, light vs. dark themes in season 1.

ugh...i took too long to post...Glass Dwarf beat me on the purge stuff! lol

Keep up the great discussion everyone!

Anonymous said...

Horus Horace

WOW

Anonymous said...

Ok, so if the Others are indigenous to the island, then why does one of Amys attackers have a tattoo of a horseshoe? Surely there's no tattoo parlours kicking about?
And if there is some Egyptan connection as there seems to be, then could it also be that there is an alien connection as well? I know that's pretty far fetched even for Lost, but you never know. Hell, the island could even be a space ship crashed landed on earth:)

Anonymous said...

Iam asking a stupid question and maybe you all know but I don't Why are we not having LOST this week? Help I can't wait until next week.

Anonymous said...

Ok this is random ,but who do u think the baby of Amy and Horus is? it could be Daniel, but im not sure. Also do u think that Charlotte's body dissapeared because it couldn't be in the same spot as another Charlotte (the little girl)????

Mike V. said...

Yeah....that crazy alien theory has been thrown around for awhile too lol I remember when I saw the end of Indiana Jones 4 last summer thinking...."i really hope this isn't how LOST ends!!" lol ahhh good times. If that island turns into a spaceship and leaves earth's orbit....I think I'd refuse to write the last blog!

Okay...the reason for no new episode this week. Comes down to simple math and advertising dollars. The LOST team is contracted to do 17 hours worth of LOST this season (the original 16 plus an extra hour for the strike shortened season last year). Since they started in January (with 2 of those 17 hours right off the bat mind you!) instead of February...it was a foregone conclusion that they were going to have to skip at least ONE week to get the episodes to go into May Sweeps period. The LOST finale is usually one of the EVENT episodes that closes the TV season. So they need to skip enough weeks to allow this to happen. I have to do the math to figure out if there will be any more skips! But I would guess the Wednesday before Memorial Day would be the 2 hour Season Finale unless they decide to end a week earlier than Idol...how anti-climatic would THAT be!?)

Last anonymous...that isn't a random question at all...in fact that's the main question to come out of last week's episode! (even though his name is HORACE and is being COMPARED to the egyptian god "HORUS"...semantics! lol) Anyway...i don't think anyone knows who that baby is...but based on that video I posted Thursday or Friday....

*********MILD SPOILER **********







Reiko (Amy) already knows who the baby is...so that's a good indication that we'll be finding out at some point this season!

***********************************




Also...I'm guessing Charlotte stayed behind because she died...nothing really much beyond that. As we all know...our Time Leapers lept to a time when they were all definitely on that Island. There was even a conversation between Sawyer and Locke asking why Locke didn't go and warn himself to do things differently!

Dorothy Sanders said...

Ok can someone please explain why the Oceanic 6 "have" to go back now? What's the point? Locke re-aligned the wheel, the jumps stopped, the nosebleeds stopped, everyone other than Charlotte is more or less okay, if stuck 30 years in the past, so what am I missing here? What plans does the island have for the Six (and for Desmond, and, hopefully, Walt) that have nothing to do with the needle-skip problem? And how mad are Jack, Kate and Hurley going to be once they realize that they apparently didn't need to come back to save everybody?

Frederick Stevenson said...

You know, I just love Sawyer's character on this show. Just think what Lost would be without him. Now we see that in the absence of Jack and Locke, Sawyer is the closest thing these people have to a leader. How scary is that???
What we see in “Lafleur” is a man finally ready to step into that position and his three-year journey to a sort of peace that operated entirely outside of the show’s mythology, the simple sort of life he never got to lead before. And now he even has captured the heart of Juliet. Exactly how many men has she slept with anyway?

Mike V. said...

Dorothy...I don't think we really know exactly why they have to be back yet. There are theories out there (DOC Jensen on ew) that think that if the Oceanic 6 never left and Locke turned the wheel...they all still wouldve gone back to DHARMA Times without the Island Skipping problem. There might be something they need to accomplish back then or "LEARN" before they are brought back to present times.

We know Widmore told Locke that there is a WAR coming, and that if they weren't back on the Island...the wrong side would win. Of course, we can't trust anything Widmore or Ben says...but maybe at least THAT part wasn't a lie.

I'm going to guess that the 2nd half of this season is going to set up the final act of the show and we should have a pretty good idea of why they needed to come back. Whether we buy into what the writers have in mind??? that remains to be seen! lol

Anonymous said...

Where things left off, the O6 are back on the island in Dharma times; do you think this will intersect with Ben coming to the island? And if so, how do you think the writers will handle it?

Mike V. said...

It's a tough call with Ben. I am thinking he already IS on the Island in 1977. He was born at some point in the 60's...and looks to be about 12 when he comes to the island.

But yeah, I'm sure they'll have to address Ben being there on the show. Maybe it will allow us to get more information on Annie and if she is still around when the purge happens 15/16 years later.

Brendan said...

Mike:

I believe some1 already pointed out this tidbit on Richard but I wanted to hear ur thoughts, as we kno in 54 in the jughead episode he has a similar clean-cut look as he did last week in 74, we kno that when Ben is a kid on the island he runs into Richard in the jungle where he has long hair, simple "native" attire and looks to be living in much simpler conditions. Do you think this will have anything to do wit the incident and this truce that is on the verge of falling apart, it seems to be that this would be part of the reason Richard and his people would be in that condition when Ben as a kid sees him.

Mike V. said...

That's a good question Brendan. Why DID Richard look so different when he met Ben? You might be right with it being something with the "incident." Of course...we know from season 2, that the OTHERS tried to appear not as sophisticated as they actually were. Fake Masks, native clothing, barefoot, built the whole facade for Michael to believe they were hillbillies in tents with a couple rifles. But we also now know that Richard showed up in DHARMAVILLE (barracks) all clean cut and everything. So, I'm lost on this one!! One would think this would need to be explained though!

Dana Tripp said...

To address the comments made by Fredrick above, Sawyer has never been one to care about the island’s mysterious properties: he listens to Locke because he appeals to his love for Kate and not because of any belief in the island’s system. After spending two weeks seeing how a man of science and a man of faith react to the island’s power, Sawyer is the one character who has never cared for either category: he is a man driven by survival, the person who hoardes supplies, takes control of guns, and who becomes the badass outlaw. But now, without one of those leaders in place, he’s also the perfect person to leave this ragtag group - while we get the great scene where he discovers that the entire group told Horace to speak to him about who they were, he also realizes that this was per his instructions, and that he had to put his money where his mouth was.

Brendan said...

Yea its clear y the writers had sawyer jump outta the chopper, bc the island scenes wulda been flat out boring w/o his antics, it also made sense in the plot bc i think unlike kate, sawyer was realistic enuff to kno that there was nuthin waiting for him bak in the real world, he knew hes a better person on the island and its his chance to start over, it will be interesting to see if they continue to portray him as a leader now that jacks bag, personally i find sawyer easier to pull for.

Dana Tripp said...

Yeah, I absolutely love the interaction between Sawyer and Juliet now. Sawyer’s speech to her on the dock, noting how he wouldn’t be able to survive on the island without her, was not him conning her into staying or trying to keep her from falling into another man’s arms (See: a great deal of his interactions with Kate). Much as his life has become simple with time, Sawyer chooses Juliet because there are no more complications, no more need to run, no more need to steal her from another man’s clutches. Sawyer has gone from being the source of a lot of drama to actually being the mediator of them.

imoen said...

i loved this episode! it wasn't as intense as the last few, but it did bring up alot of things.

my first thought of when i saw the full statue was that it was some sort of egytian god or ruler(they always wear those head peice things) and looking at some pics at first glance it looks like anibus has 4 toes (but if you look real close you can see all 5)

at first in this episode i thought that horace was jacob, since he was the leader and all, but i don't really want him to be i like the biblical idea better, that aaron is the great great grandson of jacob, that would be a reason for claire and christian to be in the cabin. and it would make jack and ray important also.

i also think that maybe horace really wasn't building the cabin for his wife but for jacob to live in. i also think that is nose bleed only came from the purge, in the man behind the curtain it did show horace on a bench with a bloody nose, so.

now it looks like we don't have a love triangle but a love square,lol. but i guess juliet and sawyer are good together, but i like the way he is when he is with kate.

and i really want to know what happend to aaron!!!!!!!!

Jane said...

I really hope they clear up that time line issue involving Ben's meeting a more primitive Richard after we see him already more modern years before. It better not be just a writing error, that would be extremely disappointing.

So, when the LOSTies traveled back to the "Jughead" days with the Others, was that before the Dharma Initiative got started? Do you think the American military doing experiments was the beginning of Dharma, or maybe led to experimenters' curiosity of the island, which led to the creation of Dharma? Or are we supposed to believe that during those times the Others were already living on the island somewhere separated from the DI? At first I thought the DI was there too, and we were only seeing the Others' camp, but now I think they just hadn't begun yet. Maybe you guys know the DI history and time line better than I do.

Also, am I the only one that thinks its weird that The Others call themselves The Others? Its supposed to be a name the LOSTies gave to them because they were "other" unknown people with them on the island. Now I see at least Juliette calling them (and herself) that, if not anyone else doing it too. Or did she just get it from some of the LOSTies??

Anyways, Brendan mentioned that Sawyer knew he had nothing to go back for and that that was a good reason for jumping out of the helicopter, but what about his daughter? Or, did he just figure that her mamma had raising her under control? lol. I know, he did it for Kate and it did a good job fitting the story but I just thought its probably at least something to go back for.

Jane said...

Wait, also, I think we may have talked about this somewhere but I just watched that video of "Getting Lost" and it says that Ben is already a little boy and on the island at the time when Amy's baby is born. Is this right? I'm so confused. If so, that makes me think that Richard and everyone most likely dressed that way to trick Ben into joining them somehow.

Anonymous said...

Hey I just discovered this blog and I can't believe I have been missing out on it!! Anyways a quick question: What is the point of having Miles on the island? The other people recruited by Widmore have their purpose. Daniel is the physicist who knows everything about time travel, Charlotte has been on the island before and knew the polar bears where in Tunisia, but Miles? He has some cool ghostbusting abilities and can detect dead people underground but how does that help the rest of the group? I don't understand his whole purpose on the island. Maybe he'll take a major role on later episodes. This next week and a half without lost will be the longest one ever!!!!

Daniel F.

Mike V. said...

Well people who magnified the sound during Sawyer and Kate's whisper-chat on the helicopter suspect that he said something like the following "I have a daughter in Albuquerque. Find her, tell her I'm sorry" So he definitely had the daughter on his mind. I'm thinking a Kate flashback will show Kate reuniting with Cassidy and discovering the connection she had to Sawyer before the crash.

DHARMA...i'm thinking it started in the 70s. Based on the history lesson we received from Eloise Hawking in the LAMP POST station, the early folks of DHARMA had found evidence of the Island and then determined how to find it. One piece of that evidence was the US Military being there in the 50s. Not sure why I didn't think about this before...but I guess it always could've been the DeGroots that were involved in the creating of the LAMP POST. And we haven't heard about Alvar Hanso in awhile, but he was the financial backer of DHARMA.....AND his great ancestor...MAGNUS HANSO was on the Black Rock. So...there are definitely ties with DHARMA back to the beginning of the Island. Ahhhh interesting stuff!

Others being called "OTHERS"....i think it is kinda silly too. But I think it's for our benefit. The survivors of 815 have always known them as "THE OTHERS" so they kept the name around for us. DHARMA calls them the Hostiles. I think Juliet humors the 815ers by calling them "OTHERS" to them. Even Charles Widmore said..."i didn't know them as OTHERS...they were my people" or something like that. So it's just how people have labeled them. We can all thank Danielle Rousseau for first calling them The Others....man she knows how to make names stick!

Yeah, i watched that video too....they don't know "MUCH" more than us...besides interviewing the Executive Producers every week. But I just think it's a safe bet that Ben is on the Island at this point. But we're sure to run into him!

Welcome to the blog Daniel F! good question on Miles...i've been wondering the same thing. Of course, it's really starting to look like he was born on the island too...and based on the baby we saw in the season premiere this year....it's probably a safer bet to think that he is Dr. Pierre Chang (Marvin Candle)'s child. There has to be some explanation for his tendencies to sense the dead. And I'm sure that explanation has to do with his previous interactions with the Island.

whew...that's enough typing for now!

Genghis Cochrane said...

Okay. I haven't seen this theory here yet. Just wanted to put it out there and see what people think.

Who is Jacob? Most people tend to think he is a Shepherd, and I tend to agree. Is it Jack? Is it Christian? Is it Christian's father?

I think that it is entirely possible that Jacob is the next Shepherd, the one currently presiding in Kate Austin's womb. Think about it. At this point women are able to have babies on the island. We assume Charlotte and Miles were and have witnessed a healthy baby being born last episode. (Discussion of who this baby is will be saved for another time).

So what changes? Why do the babies stop being born normally? Perhaps during Kate's pregnancy something goes wrong, due to the baby being conceived in the 2000s and born in the 70s. Not sure what it could be, but time travel is a funny thing. Something strange happens and after Jacob's birth, all other women (maybe Kate included) die during birth. (I need a refresher as to whether this disease kills the baby too...)

Neither Jack, nor Kate, nor Sawyer knows about Jacob, so they name this baby Jacob and put him in a shack to think about what he did. Still doesn't explain why Richard listened to Locke back in the 1950s when he said Jacob sent him, but its a show about time travel. I don't think it matters.

Anyway, I think the baby Kate is probably having will have some major implications. Are they the most major? Only time will tell.

Great blog by the way! And great discussions.

Jenn said...

I think Miles was recruited by Widmore for the mission because he may be able to communicate with Jacob. Or maybe Widmore/Abaddon helped orchestrate Christian's arrival on the island, and perhaps they thought that Miles could communicate with him.

Genghis Cochrane said...

To add to my thought.

Jacob's effect on Dharma women leaves them weak and open for takeover from the others. They turn Jacob into a hero, but it is something he doesn't want to be and remains a recluse in the cabin.

I totally think that Jin had been looking for Rose and Bernard and not the Oceanic 6 when he tells Sawyer that they finished searching the grid.

Brendan said...

One thing that really confuses me among others is how Charlotte remembered Dan telling her as a kid to not come back to the island, and he said u cant change the past, yet hes tryin to go back to 77 and says hes not going to tell Charlotte that again, i dont get it.

Mike V. said...

Brendan, who is to say that Dan DOESN'T go back and tell Charlotte? Whatever happened...happened. Dan seems conflicted right now and doesn't want to tell her...but something might propel him to do it anyway.

Genghis....pretty interesting theory there! Of course, a lot of it relies on the fact that Kate actually IS pregnant. I'd say the odds are in favor of that being the case...but we don't know for sure. But the issue with people dying during pregnancy has been tied back to being CONCEIVED on the Island. If Kate has already conceived...then she would probably be in the clear. lol

Farrah said...

So I’m still hung up on who could be Amy’s son.

My first thought is that it could be Desmond – we don’t know anything about his childhood, he could have been born there and then Amy taken him off the Island via sub at some point. We’ve witnessed how “special” he can be with the ability to time travel. He has some strong unknown ties to the island. In addition, we’ve been told that he’s been destined to return to the island from Mrs. Hawking’s speech about the island not being done with him yet. He may be the key.

My other thought for Amy’s son are Daniel (Ellie may have taken him from Amy as a return for 2 Others being killed and only 1 Dharma). We’ve seen the Others take babies before although they may not have had the same motives.

Awesome job Mike - LOVE the blog!!!

HurleyAteMe said...

I have not heard anyone discuss this. What is the possiblilty that Sawyer's daughter becomes more of a storyline at some point in the future? How old was she when 815 crashed?
Genghis- I am not sure I agree with everything you say about Jacob but I do like the point that maybe he is a recluse and does not want the power, ie: saying to Locke ,Help me. My feeling the whole time is that the show will get to the point where that statement makes sense. At least I hope it is explained.

Mike V. said...

interesting idea farrah...i ruled out Dan as the son with Eloise being the mother (maybe you're right..not biological)....and of course...duration on the island (he never had a nosebleed during the flashes). I had thought Desmond too...except for the simple fact that there is NO WAY that he is only 30 years old in the present day! lol Thanks for the compliments!

HurelyAteMe, I would agree that we still need to know more information about Jacob's "Help Me" comment. It could've been as simple as he needed John's help to save the Island. But I'm sure there is more...especially with the fact that he cannot be seen right now. (except for the brief image)

AreUPokey said...

You know, I like what Ghengis was saying about Kate. There was a reason we saw Jack and Kate have their little "moment" the night before they went back to the island.

At the time it seemed a rather odd thing for them to do considering the scope of what they were planning to do the next day, not to mention the fact that they had had a pretty ugly break-up. But it would all make sense if the point was Kate getting pregnant.

So if Kate gets pregnant in 2006 and then goes back in time that certainly could cause some complications, and maybe this is the very reason that no children can be conceived and born on the island.

What I'm thinking is this:
Hawking tells the Oceanic 6 that the island is always moving. That moving would have to be at a consistent and measurable rate in order for the Lamp Post to be accurate in determining where the island would be at any given time.
I'm guessing that the consistency of its travel was based upon the steady movement of the donkey wheel.

When Ben pushes the wheel it was clearly frozen and not moving at all. He had to break the ice to get to it. Could this mean that he had in effect frozen the island in place? This would explain why Widmore, who was clearly searching for the island and knew all about Hawking but was not able to find it.

Now when Locke pushes the wheel it is clearly not frozen and in fact is kind of twitching like it has simply come unhinged. So Locke puts it back on its track and it then resumes it's steady movement which in turn stabilizes the island and the people on it while at the same time allowing the Lamp Post to once again accurately determine its location.

Now perhaps this little hiccup in the island's movement threw off the whole equilibrium of time so to speak. The island, while now stabilized, is still not on its original path and therefore does not allow children to be born as it could potentially change some past or future event.

And perhaps this is the reason that the donkey wheel gets frozen. It may have been Ben's attempt to fix the fertility problem.

Mike V. said...

It's all intriguing...but I dunno lol I was liking my theory that when Desmond blew the hatch, the Island stopped moving making it visible and reachable by the freighter. I don't know how the wheel would get frozen by the hatch imploding but the facts and timeline seems to fit with that event.

But yeah...if kate is pregnant and traveling back in time and THEN the issues begin..that would be interesting...and very great timing considering Sawyer said earlier in the episode maybe the issue with conception hadn't happened yet on the Island.

But do we really think BEN froze the wheel? he had to do quite a bit to get to that cave! blow up the orchid station and break through a sheet of ice just to fall into the cave. I'm still going with Hatch implosion for now! lol

David said...

I've been wanting to post for a few days about who I think Amy and Horace's child is but I haven't had the chance...my theory has already been voiced (well typed) by an Anonymous contributor I think. It was basically suggesting that Jacob was the baby and that when we saw Horace building the Cabin in Locke's vision, he was building it FOR Jacob. I do concede the point about Jacob being mentioned in the 50's but that could well be something to do with Richard, maybe he is a time traveller somehow and thus knows about Jacob another way. Or something! If you think about it as well..the cabin wasn't built by Horace until the 80s, early 90s? In the Horace vision while he is building the cabin, he says he has been dead for 12 years..so where has the almighty Jacob been residing since the 50s?


I think it is key that we didn't learn the baby's name or anything in the episode when he was born, I think that is going to be a big reveal. What other (better) way would there be to tell us more about the mysterious Jacob than to show us his life from birth? There are so many point for and against this argument and I am not ruling it out being the case, I love it!

Beatriz said...

Has anyone thought that maybe the baby is born ,but that the "hostiles" kidnap him and that is what starts the suppopsed "war"?and that is why no baby was supposed to be born on the island?

AreUPokey said...

Mike,
I agree with the idea that the hatch implosion was what allowed the island to be found, but I think it is a separate issue from the island moving.

Hawking says the island couldn't be found because it was always moving through time. Now if Ben or anyone else had somehow been able to stop the island's movement then the island would require a different way to be hidden.

Maybe the hatch button was more of a cloaking device that prevented the island from being seen. So when the hatch goes boom the island becomes visible.

Now as far as Ben freezing the wheel:
According to Widmore, Ben tricked him into pushing the wheel and getting expelled from the island. This is interesting because Widmore says he was the leader at the time. Now how is it that the leader of the Others wouldn't know what the donkey wheel does and Ben, a Dharma recruit, does? Are we to assume that it was Dharma who first discovered the wheel. It's certainly possible, but it's also hard to imagine that Richard, who has seemingly been on the island forever, wouldn't have known about it. So did Richard assist Ben in getting Widmore booted? We've seen Richard go behind Ben's back to help Locke out, so this would also not be unprecedented. But in this scenario Richard would be building up quite a list of enemies wouldn't he? Okay I've gone off topic here.

Anyway, clearly Ben knew about the wheel when Widmore pushed it. And we know that Ben had plenty of contacts in the outside world. Maybe Ben learns about the Lamp Post, realizes that Widmore will be seeking revenge and now has a way to find the island, and decides to take a drastic step by interfering with the movement of the island.

The unique thing about Ben is that he was a member of Dharma and an Other. He would thus have knowledge of both the scientific properties of the island and all the stations Dharma created as well as having knowledge of the mystical properties of the island that the Others seem so keen on defending. In a sense this makes Ben both a Man of Science and a Man of Faith.

The big question, now that time travel has been firmly established, is whether or not Ben accomplished these things the first time through, or if he went back in time after the fact and changed some things. We still have to learn about the "rules" that Ben claimed Widmore changed when Alex was killed. Was Alex supposed to have accomplished something in the future, so it was off limits to kill her? If that was the case then Faraday's comment, "What happens, happened" wouldn't quite fit. If time travel requires people to willingly follow the rules, yet they aren't necessarily compelled to do so, then we'd have a whole different ballgame. So what are the rules and who made them? Why would Ben assume that Widmore, a man whom he allegedly betrayed, would actually honor any system of rules that had been put into place between them?

cdstedman said...

During the last flash Miles commented that it felt like an earthquake. Could the last earthquake flash been the cause of the statues destruction? It may have also caused the volcano eruption that has been mentioned in the past.

Mike V. said...

Interesting stuff with the Island Cloaking and not moving through time Pokey. You could be onto something there. I agree, that it would seem silly for the wheel to become "FROZEN" based on the hatch implosion...i just can't figure out how else it would have happened. But I guess we're not meant to really know quite yet.

And i agree that we need to know more about these RULES! Interesting though that maybe ben knew Alex was not supposed to die because of an event in the future. I had heard that Hawking and Dan's theory of not being able to change the future would be put to the test this season...so perhaps we'll find out! In the meantime, very well thought out theories you have going there!

Stedman...I had actually thought that too about the statue and the earthquake. Didn't even consider the volcano but that's a good point too!

btw...there's a new Doc Jensen today on ew.com (too lazy to go find the link! just tywpe in ew.com and it's one of the main stories!)

btw#2...there's probably going to be another 1 week break from episodes in April (clip show)...which should give us a 2 hour finale on May 20th! Sounds about right!

Weasel said...

As far as the donkey wheel being frozen. The DI had parkas for the donkey wheel room and been knew he would need one, so I don't think it was previously frozen.

I still think the island was hidden by it being an a 108 minute time loop, so it was not WHEN it was supposed to be so it could not be found. The only hole in that theory is: how did the food drops happen if the island's location in time was obscured from the outside world. I'm sure there is some way to explain that as well, but my brain is starting to hurt just thinking about it.

Danica said...

Wonderful Blog. I am so glad I found it last season. I love to read all the intelligent comments.

What is in Dan's book? I think he has traveled a few times and the book is all his memories and events that happened each time he moved.

It is hard to believe some characters like Ben, Dan and Miles. Dan and Miles' mission is still not really clear.

Why did Miles mention their directive to not intervene in the last episode? Is he still on his original mission?

Why doesn't Miles use his "powers" more? There must be all kinds of dead people on that island.

Jane said...

I'm not sure if anyone mentioned this, but in response to the question about the food drops, maybe it was Ben and the Others who dropped food to the LOSTies to help them out...?

Danica, I'd also be interested in seeing more of Miles's powers and I'm curious to see if/when they will really come into play.

And where the hell is Claire?? I am dying to see the rest of her story and how she ended up with Christian (or Jacob)!

Jane said...

One more thing.. I really am starting to get the feeling that we were supposed to assume that Rose and Bernard died with the flaming arrows. Remember when Juliette stopped to put the fire out on that man? Was that Bernard? What do you guys think???

Mike V. said...

Couple things:

Emile de Ravin (Claire) is not a regular cast member in season 5. This was announced at the end of season 4. However, she is signed on as a series regular for the finale season. So, we probably won't be getting her story until either the end of this season or possibly next.

As for Rose and Bernard, we know that the actors that play those characters are ALSO not series regulars. And I just don't think that they would kill them off with no fanfare whatsoever. And if they did...we will still see the story of how it happened to give them the official ending they deserve! I am confident the writers have a plan for them!

Thanks for the props again everyone! Was said having no lost tonight (except the ENHANCED rerun of LaFleur) but we'll get through it! No fears!

Jane said...

Oh no! No Claire for so long =(
Who walked in on her and Christian in the cabin again? That scene was so weird. Maybe I can find it on Lostpedia.

I miss poor Charlie too. I can't wait until we see him in Hurley's explanation of how/why he has the guitar with him (I hope).

That sucks about there being another break coming up. But just think, only one more week til next time!

Mike V. said...

Jane, that was Locke that walked into the Cabin. He received the directions to "Move the Island"

I'm fine with the breaks! Once they announced 16 straight through episodes for 3 seasons, I figured it was going to happen anyway. There is just not enough episodes to stretch from January to May! And the show HAS to end that last week before Memorial Day for optimum ratings and ad money! lol

On the bright side, because of the strike season last year...we're getting 17 this season and 17 next. Although, I'm guessing that the Producers will probably negotiate for extra time next season to tell their finale stories like they did in season 1 and 4. Since the season 6 finale is going to be the SERIES FINALE...something tells me it's going to be EPIC! lol

Hope we see Charlie this season too!

Weasel said...

So, if you can't change what is going to happen, at some point in the last season Clair and Aaron will be getting off the island. Desmond saw it so it HAS to happen.

Jane said...

Yea, but Des said he saw baby Aaron get off the island with claire and now he is 3 so I don't know what that's about.

Anonymous said...

Hey guys,

Just wanted to say I really missed Lost this week :(

So I think it was AreUpokey... who said the "moment btw Jack and Kate" is significant and other ppl have mentioned about Kate being pregnant, I just wanted to put my 2 cents in.... I dont think Kate is pregnant and I really believe that them being intimate was for 2 reasons... One was just Kate's way of manipulating Jack - she needed someone and knew he'd be there for her plus it gave the segway into Christian's shoes etc... I think she was vulnerable and needed Jack.

2... Remember Ms. Hawking said we had to recreate the events just as it was the same as the original flight... and the night before Oceanic 815 Boone and Shannon were intimate... And since other significant items were brought on the plane (items of the dead in fact) to still recreate the flight I am assuming that this intimate event btw Jack and Kate is to recreate Boone and Shannon.

Also, I think Miles' is Pierre Chang's son.... His powers are probably a byproduct of the "incident" which does cause him to speak to the dead and perhaps what causes the fertility problems with children being conceived on the island.

I personally am looking fwd to see what "jobs" Kate and Jack and Hurley pick up in the Dharma group...

Oh and hey Mike, just wanted to ask - has Alvar Hanso ever been mentioned by any of the Lost characters or was he just in a Dharma film??? I was trying to remember...

Thanks,
Mona

Anonymous said...

Just found this site, and I must say I have been enjoying the discussions. I have some questions about the overall timeline, and I'd like to get other people's thoughts.(if this has been covered already I apologize, only read the last few blogs)

We get a pretty firm date for the 'purge' from Horace telling John that he's been dead for 12 years in late '04. We also get a pretty firm date of Rousseau's arrival on the island as being 16/17 years before '04, based on the radio transmission, and the apparent age of Alex. My problem is that it seems that Rousseau's group should have landed after the purge. The DI had to have built the radio tower, and they certainly would have come to investigate why the message was changed, and by who. Plus, Rousseau tells Sayid that she has not seen other people on the island, just heard them. I can believe that the Others managed not to be seen,(they can be quite ninja-like) but someone from the DI would have crossed her path in the 4 yrs that they were both on the island.

Just wondering if anyone else has any thoughts on this.

Mike V. said...

Last anonymous post...hmmmm that's a really good point on Rousseau/DHARMA. Do we officially know that the radio tower is DHARMA's though? It would make sense that it was...but I don't recall seeing their logo on anything there. That could be THE OTHERS' tower and part of their truce not to go near it. As for her not running into any DHARMA folks? Well, you got me there. I guess we know that she had pretty much gone insane at that point...and probably had set her traps in her area and didn't leave it. It's a pretty darn big Island...DHARMA may not have gone into that territory.

Lots of assumptions there...but I'm guessing that is how the producers would explain it lol

Mona, I don't think anyone else has SPECIFICALLY mentioned "ALVAR" Hanso other than in the film. The others talked about a "GREAT MAN" which at the time we thought was Alvar, but have since probably determined it was Jacob. maybe...lol Anyway, we have heard the name MAGNUS HANSO as a member of the Black Rock during an auction we see during Desmond's time travels in "THE CONSTANT"....widmore bid on the black rock journal.

That's all we have so far!

MJ said...

TV Guides weekly Getting Lost vid is out. Slightly spoilery - so be careful. Some guy has a pretty good guess on the statue. 4 names given on who Amy's baby is - and one of them is correct, but they don't say which !


http://www.tvguide.com/News/Getting-Lost-statue-1003991.aspx

Mike V. said...

thanks for the link MJ and the warning. I don't even think I want a list of 4 names, so I'm gonna avoid that one!

Anonymous said...

Just a quick thought on the island being cloked or traveling through time. Way back in season 1 there was and episode that had some unexplained tidal movments happening. To me this would suggest time travel, because if the island was just cloked then surely the tides would remain constant?

B

Jane said...

Just another point about my question of who walked in on Claire and Christian in the cabin (Locke):
Why didn't he say anything to anyone about seeing Claire (or did he)??? Did he maybe not fully believe it himself, or just didn't think anyone would believe him?

I hate when they keep important info to themselves. We all know they do it all too much! all part of the great seduction of Lost, though.

Anonymous said...

that link for tv guide isn't agreeing with my computer, is there any other way i could watch the videos?

gnni4 said...

Wish I hadn't watched that video!

Finally got a google name and don't have to be annonomous anyomore, yeah!

Can't wait till Wednesday!

Jennifer

mary said...

wow, interesting video! i really liked the theory on the statue

Sri Lankan said...

Hey Mike Great work, really appreciate the time and effort you put in to this.

Regarding the island moving... may be it moves only in time and not in space, Tahiti seems to me in close proximity to the island at all times, allowing the islanders to travel by submarine and also for penny`s boat to drop them off in a island nearby to Tahiti when the O6 got rescued.

There seems to be more than one way to get to the island,Flight 815s landing and the 06s return was with a flash and crash... where as Juliet`s entry was by a uneventful submarine ride (as far as we know)

Mike V. said...

Sri Lanken, thanks for the compliments on the blog!

I would agree with you about the island possibly not moving in space....but we know that the nigerian drug plane ended up on the island too. of course...maybe it just flew through one of those crazy "windows" and ended up on the island. we also know that the black rock was in the indian ocean...and ended up right smack in the middle of the island.

As for Juliet arriving at the island....yeah everyone keeps talking about taking this submarine...but we still have not seen anyone actually be transported via submarine to the island. we saw juliet drugged...and woke up strapped in on the sub. Seems a little shady!

as for Penny...they definitely were out in that water traveling somewhere for a WEEK while they came up with their plan and traveled close to where the "supposed" flight 815 crashed.

I just don't know WHAT to think about that crazy island moving yet...but i'm sure we'll find out eventually!!!

Mike V. said...

btw...based on the comments here...still very glad i haven't watched that crazy tv guide video! lol

mary said...

yeah the video was kinda revealing, wish i hadn't watched it!

MJ said...

Eh - the four names they list as being the possibilities of the child are nothing that hasn't been pondered by all of us. The reveal there is that ONE of them is correct, without telling us which one.

The stuff on the statue - is purely conjecture. But interesting, and I am agreeing with them on who the statue represents. Makes better sense than the Anubus and Horus theories.

Mike V. said...

Hey MJ, I'm sure you're right that it wasn't too big of a deal. I just didn't want to limit my speculation for now lol I'm weird with what spoilers I decide to look into and which ones I don't!


New Doc Jensen Everyone!

Beatriz said...

Mike V

I have been reading different blogs and for some reason I am"understanding" that Amy was pregnant with Paul's baby when he was shot. Is this true? Did I miss something or is this totally incorrect? Pleae someone clarify

Peter said...

some gud interview questions here. thought I'd share!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ph19PSx6tlg

MJ said...

Am hoping we get to see Daniel in 1977 tonight. He was conspicuously absent in the last ep where we found out what Sawyer, Juls, Jin and Miles were up to in the DI.

Beatriz - Paul got killed in 74 when he and Amy were picnicing and Sawyer & company came upon them. Amy gave birth in 77 after taking up with Horace.

Jane said...

Lost tonight yahoo!!! ew.com gives some spoilers, some that answer some questions that you posted after last ep, Mike!

LostFamiloy said...

Okay, things are getting weird! lol I love reading all the theories that everyone is coming up with. One thing that I haven't heard anyone talk about since we first saw it a long time ago: what is the deal with the "cave" that is hidden behind a secret door in Ben's closet in his house in Othersville, that he enters to unleash "Smokey"? When he comes out he has smudges of black on his face. The entrance to that "cave" (?) had heiroglyphics on it. I want to see that again and see where it goes! It has to go underground - and what does it connect to?

Also, we haven't seen or gotten any mention of Smokey lately either. I wonder if we're going to find out if the military saw it, or when DI discovered it. Seems like the sonic fence is there for protection from just it since Richard (and all the hostiles?) can just waltz right by it.

But seeing our Losties in DI jumpsuits is a good time! I, too, am wondering how Kate, Jack and Hurley are going to integrate into Dharma. And I'm assuming boy Ben is already on the island at this point - will be very cool when our Losties meet young Ben!

The blog is as awesome as ever and I'm glad to see how many fans you have attracted over the years -good job Mike!

Mike V. said...

You think THIS is a lot of comments, wait until you get to season 6! lol But thank you Lost Familoy (typo and all! :-)) for the major props!

You're asking all of the right questions and I will say that you most likely will not be disappointed in getting some of those answers! I love this season...can't wait to watch it again! But I have to finish my season 6 rewatch and then go back and start over lol

I think throughout the show they pretty much implied that DHARMA built that sonic fence to protect themselves from Smokey. And Richard seals the deal in this episode by telling them "that thing may keep other things out of here but it doesn't keep us out" or something like that (yeah..again..can't believe I remember quotes from episodes and know exactly where you are in the story! Lol)

Thanks for continuing to post your thoughts as you go through your LOST-A-THON! I'm glad you're enjoying the blog! Talk to you in a future episode!

LostFamily said...

LOL - yes I tried to retract the typo and it was too late. And you are beyond impressive to remember details about this episode at this point! Agreed - Richard did mention keeping 'other things out' which is what made me realize we haven't seen Smokey for a while or (other than that indirect mention) heard anyone talking about it.

Looking forward to finding out what our new character Ceasar is up to and where Sun and Sayid (and Ben) are post-return plane crash. Onward1

Mike V. said...

I had to think about Sayid, Sun and Ben before I responded to your comment...realizing that you don't know yet! LOL You'll find out soon enough! Enjoy!

Mike V. said...

I know Miles is reading this one next in his 1st watch of LOST, and I just read my first paragraph. Seems I thought this one was a little more of a letdown than the previous 2 episodes at the first time. Well, in hindsight, I think this is a really really well executed episode of LOST and just as good as the previous 2 eps. This whole season just ages so well with time. Just my opinion! Had to make that slight update to my opening statement of the episode. :)

Miles Balzard said...

Man, this episode threw me for yet another loop. 1974? 1977? Weren't we just in 1954? Well, it appears we're going to settle into the 1974-1977 era of the island(s) for a while, and I was kind of slow to come around to that. The specific circumstances of 1977 were particularly difficult for me.

I know from watching a show like Mad Men what I feel like when there's a big change in the dynamic. Like when that British firm bought Sterling Cooper and Lane became the new CFO. As with all major changes in all shows that I've loved, initially I get upset and think, "No, no, don't change the plot like this! I liked the way it was going just fine, and now you bring in all this new crap and you're just gonna ruin it for me!"

And then I get proven wrong when the show ascends to new (or at least different) heights and maintains the same quality of entertainment or better.

But that upset feeling came right back as I watched Sawyer become head of security for the Dharma initiative and changed his name to Jim LeFleur. "Oh no, this isn't the way to go! What the hell are you doing, Lost?"

But as I learned to trust the writers on Mad Men, I have already learned to trust the writers on Lost. I knew they would take this someplace really good if I gave it half-a-minute of patience. And by the time Sawyer convinced Juliet to stay for two weeks and it turned into three years, I was already invested. Sure, it was a little weird seeing Juliet and Sawyer as lovers after being a Skater for so long, but I'm quite happy for both of them. You got a winner there, Sawyer! Don't blow it!

But I know Sawyer is gonna blow it after the closing scene shows Sawyer and Kate exchange a classic look of long-lost love! And now I'm dually conflicted because I was a Skater for four seasons! I don't want Juliet to get hurt, but I know she's gonna get hurt because Sawyer's true love is Kate. Will Juliet end up back in Jack's arms? She's too smart for that, right? She knows the universe revolves around Kate, right, and neither Jack or Sawyer can ever be hers?

So despite my initial reservations, I'm all in on this new dynamic with Lost. I'm sure Sayid and Sun and Ben will all wander into the scene soon enough and we'll have a nice big mess again! All we need is Rose, Bernard and Vincent!

Miles Balzard said...

Ha, Mike, I just saw your comment after I posted mine. And I agree with your new view of things, because I thought this was another excellent episode. I wouldn't say it was better than the last one because I'm all about Locke, but after adjusting to the new dynamic in this ep I can see a ton of potential.

Once again, though, it was a bit of a set-up episode. Even the cliffhanger at the end, when Sawyer sees Jack, Kate and Hurley come out of the van, was a pure set up for what will happen next. But like I mentioned in the beginning of season 3, I don't mind the slower pace when they keep telling such effective character stories.

Remember a few episodes ago when I said "Sawyer is the same as he's always been" and you disagreed? Well, you definitely had a point (he's more of a team player now), but I imagine that working for the Dharma Initiative is going to change him even more. Can't wait to find out!

Mike V. said...

Miles, they jumped all around after 1954! And before the final flash, they flashed a few times too. One time like way way back...didn't you see the 4 toed statue in all its glory?

But yes...we're going to hang out in DHARMA Times for awhile. What a great way to spend more time with the DHARMA Initiative and learn what they're all about, right? Love it. I know what you mean about the dynamic shift and especially with Mad Men's change. But change can be good. LOST kept people on their toes, and every season had a different feel to it. I like that. And it turns out you do too. Yeah, with all of these great dramas (mad men, breaking bad included)...you just have to trust the writers that they'll go somewhere worthwhile.

I knew you'd be interested in the Sawyer/Juliet romance twist. Of course, I think we saw a hint of it at the end of season 4 and they started building towards it more earlier this season. But, they convinced us that they were in love in the matter of 10 minutes at the end of that episode. It was pretty impressive! The actors weren't even sure it was going to work. It totally did. But, you're right...Kate may provide some tension there.

It was also a pretty impressive episode to cover the "Flash Forward" timeframe of the Oceanic 6. We saw what they were doing for 3 years...but we didn't see what Sawyer and crew were up to. So, this was a great "get everyone up to the same point" episode. Pretty impressive stuff.

As for who else might be showing up in 1977....well, I'll let you keep watching!

Setup episodes are essential, but this one did way more than just set things up....it CAUGHT us up and established a new romance an a very efficient manner.

And yes...with your earlier comments about Sawyer, I was thinking ahead to this episode as well. He is a very much changed character from season 1. So, it was tough for me to agree! lol

Man, at this rate you might be done season 5 before tomorrow! :)

Miles Balzard said...

Oh yeah, I know they jumped all around in different times after 1954, getting nosebleeds and all, and you bet I saw the 4-toed statue in all its glory! How I wish we'd had spent even 5 more minutes in that era before a big flash hurled us into another time! But I identified with '54 the most because of Widmore's arrival and so many key historical factors that Eloise was talking about.

Yes, when we consider the first 100 days on the island and the romantic tensions, then compare it to 3 years on the island with Sawyer and Juliet in a monogamous relationship...it's gonna be really hard to see them become conflicted because of Kate (as well as Jack).

Juliet, Sawyer, Sun, Ben and Desmond are probably my top five characters at this point (Jin and Hurley trailing close behind), so anything that messes with Sawyer and Juliet being happy is something I will be rooting against!

Yes, it was a great CATCH-up episode as well, quickly providing some depth on a budding-and-then-mature romance just as we nestle in for more time with the Dharma Initiative.

No doubt, I'll be done with season 5 by the weekend! It's hard to slow down now!

Mike V. said...

Yeah, the 1954 episode was pretty great, and it also tied into Locke's flashback when Richard visited him. And not sure if you made other connections to who might be on the island during that time as well. A lot of things were set up in that episode and will come into play. And yeah...I think we all would've loved to have spent more time in the "way long ago past"...(and maybe one day the show will), but that was never a focus for LOST. There is a deep history to the island, but the only stories from the past that they end up telling are the ones that directly affect our main characters.

I'll just tell you to go with the "wait and see" approach with the romantic tension. I'll say that I was surprised what they were able to pull off.

Makes sense on the favorite characters. Poor Jack gets no love. But, he's at his lowest of the low right now. It's all by design. I'll bet you didn't think he'd get any lower than he did in season 3 (prior to that finale)! Quite the hero's journey he's on.

You're in for an awesome weekend with the rest of season 5. Enjoy!